Phillies Nation

Happ got beat up by the Mets last year didn’t he?

Happ did get beat up but showed promise if possible. He K’d 5 in 4 innings but did give up 5 earned.

Id like to see him go again.

Yeah, well it might be hard to trade him if he gets annihilated by the Mets of all teams.

I think Mazone should be the choice. I also think you can not pitch Durbin because he pitched last night.

I do not think it was Happ – wasn’t JD Durbin last year who lost the game?

yeah, Happ started a day game doubleheader against the Mets and gave up a homer to Reyes and was in trouble for most of his 5 innings.

The Mets blow.. I think Happ should get the start, or be traded… this is his chance to come up and do well. And if they don’t want to give him that shot, they should try to move him.

Did Happ come up from AA or AAA to make that start last year? And last year the Mets were a whole lot better then they are this year, so Happ is throwing better, and the Mutts are hitting worse… I don’t like our chances vs. Santana (tough LHP eat the Phillies alive) but I think Happ can give us 6 strong and limit them to 3.. = quality start?

sorry for the extra “not”

NC Jason…W/L has nothing to do with how good a pitcher is. Look at his strike outs, ERA, IP, etc. He can’t help that he gets no run support and has lost 7 games. He has been pretty dominating.

Happ was injured last year and tried to play through it. He is healthy this year and should get the call. Mazone would be okay for a spot start though. Both are lefties.

To whoever posted the Mazone and Happ statistics, they are outdated:

Happ is currently 5-6 (poor run support is mostly to blame) with a 3.54 ERA, 104 strikeouts in 101.2 innings (He leads the International League in Ks), a 1.27 WHIP, 38 walks, 91 hits, and has given up 11 home runs. Opponents hit .243 off him and his Ground out/fly out ratio is 1.06

Mazone is currently 8-6 with a 3.28 ERA, 62 strikeouts in 109.2 innings pitched (the highest amount of innings pitched in the IL), a 1.15 WHIP, 22 walks, 104 hits, and has given up 14 home runs. Opponents hit .257 off him and his Ground out/fly out ratio is 0.68

Mazone’s ERA and WHIP are a little better but there isn’t a huge difference between the two in those stats. However Happ gets a lot more strikeouts than Mazone. Even when Happ started last year for the mets when he was hurt he had 5 strikeouts in 4 innings. Mazone has given up a few more HR than Happ, but its not a big difference either. Happ gives up more walks than Mazone, but Mazone gives up more hits than Happ. Happ gets a lot more ground balls than Mazone does so that would help him at CBP. I would go with Happ, its time for him to show he can be a ML pitcher. I would rather have him be the 4/5th starter in the future than pay somebody like Eaton big bucks to do it.

Santana is just nasty and I hate him. He already beat us once this year and I fully expect he’ll do it again, but you never know, the Muts offense isn’t too great.
I heard that Moises Alou may come back for the Phillies series. So we’ll have to contend with Alou for the first three innings until he gets hurt and then it’s Endy Chavez time!

I was at the game with Santana vs Hamels and Hamels is basically a clone of Santana. He just is not as experienced as Santana. I guarantee you that Hamels will put up Santana’s Cy Young numbers sometime soon.

Durbin won’t make the start he pitched 2 innings last night. It’s gotta be Happ, he’s developed as far as he’s ever going too, and you never know e could end up being a Kendrick clone who just gets it done in the majors. Should that happen you can either trade him high or keep starting him until Myers is absoloutley ready to return.

Yea but Santana is living up to his end of the bargin… with a 3.01 ERA… and 103 Ks…. his record should be more like 10-4 right now…. and then we’d be saying he’s the best pitcher in the NL.

Agreed Dom. There’s a huge difference between a .500 Santana this season and a .500 Eaton from alst season. At that difference is run support. The Met’s blow, simple as that. If Santana was getting run support he’d be looking very worth the money.

This is a circular conversation because he is one of if not the best pitcher on a team that blows a fat one.

Eaton has 3 wins and Hamels has 8. Both should have 5 more wins than they do, but they get no run support. I’m not bashing Moyer or Kendrick when I say this, but those guys get TONS of run support, and they shouldn’t have as many wins as they do, well Moyer should. His last 3 or 4 starts he’s gotten no run support at all and lost the game eventhough he pitched well enough to get the win. The sooner people stop looking at W/L as the end all be all of a pitchers skill the quicker they’ll realize if a pitcher is good or not and the faster they’ll understand the game of baseball.

“All true about Santana a lot of K’s and a solid era. But if the guy can not win games he can be the filthiest pitcher in baseball. What would you rather a pitcher who gets out but wins 17 or 18 games. Or Santana who will strike out about 7-10 per game but only be a .500 pitcher (which is what he is projected to be this year 13-13). One would think if he continues to pitch the way he has sooner or later he will start to win games. I am just suggesting that 7-7 pitcher is NOT what the mets traded for.”

You are contradicting yourself left and right…

How about your a met fan … drive off the Walt Whitman?

What I am saying is if everyone is in agreement that the Mets suck – then give all of the personal accomplishments to Santana you want. He is still part of that team which sucks. In the case of an ace pitcher they are expected to win the close games (The 3-2 games he has been losing!). My inital comment of Sanatana not been dominate was taken to mean he is not a good pitcher, which I am agreeing that he is, but the mets were looking for a 20 guy to get them into the playoffs/ WS – and right now he is part of the collective sucking that goes on in Shea.

Santana doesn’t suck though, just the rest of his team…Whether he wins 5 games or 20 games, he still keeps them in the game and pitches great.

Oh wow, 1 start. Still a Q though. Want me to pull up Hamels bad starts?

Oh, my bad…I thought you were telling me to drive off the Walt Whitman bridge.

I realize that now.

Santana still is a great pitcher. There’s no doubt about that. He has given up 8 unearned runs though over the season, and even at unearned some of that has to fall on him for not being dominant enough to get out of the situations he’s found himself in. For example, when Mariners pitcher Felix Hernandez hit a grand slam off him last week? All four runs unearned.

Santana is still great, no doubt about it. But there are still at least a half dozen pitchers in the NL who’ve been better than him this season. Let’s not give him too much respect.