Barkley: Give Howard His Cash
Posted by Tim Malcolm, Fri, December 19, 2008 03:52 PM | Comments: 68
Posts
Randy Miller reports Charles Barkley says Ryan Howard should get a long-term deal from the Phillies.
“When you see a guy who has done what Ryan Howard has done, he should have gotten a long-term deal already,. It’s very disappointing (the Phillies) haven’t given him his due. They are doing him a disservice. He should be one of the 10 highest-paid players in the game because he’s clearly one of the 10 best players in the game.”
Has Barkley looked at Howard’s strikeouts? Really, however, it’s smarter that the Phils take their time with Howard. As for Barkley? Yeah, he loves to speak his mind, and that’s great, but where does he stop?
Posts: 0 Geoff
It would be a horrible idea to give howard an extension right now…or ever…NOBODY is worth 20mm a year, NOBODY. not even cole hamels or tim lincecum. this is ridiculous. cole hamels MUST get a contract extension, but not for that much…i think you can sign him, but for howard to be this adament about it this early is absurd…youll go year to year and he should keep his mouth shut until the final year of his contract.
Posted: 04:09 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
eh, Charles Barkley popping off again. Funny how he doesn’t mention signing Cole Hamels to a long-term deal. I wonder why that is….
Posted: 04:10 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Geoff
anyways, about brett myers: arent the angels looking to upgrade thier rotation AND are willing to trade either ervin santana or jered weaver to do it? they were willing to trade both for peavy, so why not one as the centerpiece of a brett myers deal? santana or weaver would tear up the nl…
Posted: 04:13 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Dennis
Why is this a story on here?
Posted: 04:15 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 phill these nutz
well, not for nothing, but ryan howard’s accomplished more then hamels…ONE MVP, almost won another in 08, and he pretty much carried the phils to thw WS, not to mention he’s been in the bigs longer then Hamels. I think Philly Fans and Philly in general just have something against “Da Brothas”!!! ya some racist mother effers
Posted: 04:15 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Geoff
because we need a fresh threated to get off topic on and populate
Posted: 04:18 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 RealMetsFan
It was my understanding that the Phillies did try to lock in Ryan Howard long term. He refused, wanting to test the free agent market. Sorry Phillies, this guy has Yankee written all over him.
Posted: 04:20 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
Howard wants A-Rod money. Also, Barkley doesn’t understand the way the salary system works in baseball. Players don’t make big money until they hit free agency. But enough about that.
Geoff, why would the Angels trade Erwin Santana for Brett Myers? Santana is better than Myers right now and Myers only has one year left until free agency.
Posted: 04:23 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 phill these nutz
you dont have to wait till free agency to lock up one of your studs…If the Phillies were loyal to their players they would lock him up long term…didnt Chase Utley get a contract extension last year??? Racist Mother Effers
Posted: 04:30 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
yes, I think you’ve hit it perfectly. The team with Rollins, Howard, Tom Gordon and prospects John Mayberry Jr., Michael Taylor, Dominic Brown, Anthony Hewitt and Zach Collier are racist. Thanks for clarifying that.
Posted: 04:32 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Don M
Barkley wants to be the Gov. of Alabama…. which he would need to balance budgets, and whatnot… meanwhile he’s supporting the idea of overpaying an athlete unneccesarily, just because..
I like what Barkley said about King James, but he shouldn’t get involved with how much people get paid..
Posted: 04:32 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NateB
this has nothing to do with Howard being one of “da brothas” (philly’s not that way), but it does have everything to do with Howard’s greed for more money than he’s worth. yes he has the Yankees written all over him in 2012.
Posted: 04:32 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Don M
Wasn’t Ryan Howard hitting like .230 at the All-Star break… and didn’t he set the All-Time MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL RECORD.. for STRIKEOUTS IN A SEASON
There is no need to “lock-up” a player with such levels of inconsistency..especially when you already have him under your control… all a long-term contract would do is force you to pay him millions of dollars no matter how good or how bad he may be. If you go to arbitration, and he breaks his leg in Spring Training, and misses half the season… his arbitration number the following year wouldn’t be as high.. and i know thats a crazy scenario, but its the truth. Why pay someone extra money when you don’t have to?
Hamels would be different because you plan on signing him long-term when he becomes a Free Agent.. Howard, who was asking for CRAZY salary demands, you would probably let leave… hopefully you would trade him before that if you were certain that you would not resign him
suck these nutz
Posted: 04:40 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Dave H
“That’s terrible.” Charles Barkley needs to shut his mouth and now his role. When we go into this season with Hamels under long term contract and allow Howard to go into arbitration (which makes perfect sense because a LHP is WAYYYYY more important than a guy who is going to strikeout 200 times), is Barkely going to call out Reuben Amaro JR as a racist?
Posted: 04:42 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Don M
Hamels is also only 25 next week and getting better, whereas Howard is 29 and his Batting Average, OBP, SLUGGING, and OPS have each fallen in the past 3 seasons.
He also made 19 errors at a position where your primary responsibilty it to just catch the baseball
Posted: 04:50 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Stuart
Why is he even talking about this. He is not a baseball guy, hes more basketball. Mets fan you dont know what youre talking about, he is not a yankee, and they dont want him or are even trying to get him. He will end up wearing a phillies uni for a few more years, then he wont get picked up by anyone that big. this is not a big deal, barkley should just shut his big mouth
Posted: 04:51 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Mark
Barkely isn’t looking at this from an organizations perspective. Plus, who gives two shits what this wide mouthed, in-debt gambler has to say?
I love the man when he talks basketball, but he has GOT to get over the misconception that whatever he says is important.
Sorry, Barkley but when it comes to baseball/organizational knowledge, I think 90% of us who read and write on this blog are better equipped to make a statement such as that.
Posted: 04:53 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Mark
… also, who ever gave his words life by pumping this useless garbage out into the media deserves a swift kick in the nuts.
Posted: 04:54 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Grrrumpy Miner
I wish some players would take a stand and have not only pride in their teams,but show a little compromise.K-Rod I look to because,not only did he want 5/75,he accepted the Mets offer for 3/37 and wants to be here.If Howard/or any other player regardless of which team he plays for is all about the money,and thats it,than you SHOULD want him out.I wouldn’t want any player who feels their bank account is better than the team and the fans.
Posted: 04:56 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Mark
I agree. Tom Brady, for example, took a pay cut to land Randy Moss … along with a few other key role players. I believe that Peyton Manning did the same. True role models.
Posted: 04:59 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Geoff
I didnt say the Angels would for him specifically…but after the yankees blew all that money the angels now are the most desperate team in baseball because theyre going to lose texeira…so they may overpay for derek lowe, they might even call about brett myers…id predatorily swoop in on them and try to rob them of good young pitching while offloading myers 12mm contract…
its the duty of every good GM to try and Con teams out of young pitching when and wherever possible…
Posted: 05:06 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Georgie
Sir Charles is very opinionated and never hesitant to voice those opinions, however, sometimes he’s just full of crap and you have to chuckle at what he says. Unfortunately, he may be stirring the pot here as far as Ryan and what he feels he deserves in $$$. You have to hope that Ryan just takes this with a grain of salt and realizes that Charles is well-meaning but also misinformed.
As far as the racist comments, I will admit I have not attended an Eagles or Phillies game for a long time nor do I live in Philly, so as far as the fans go, I don’t know if that goes on or not at games. I get the impression that there is a small contingent of that sort at Eagles games, and that sucks, it sucks anywhere, anytime. But I doubt that the Philles FO would let race get in their way of making as much dough as they possibly can, it’s just business to them.
Posted: 05:08 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Don M
http://www.tbs.com/video/index/#/all-video/shows/frank-tv/charles-barkley-clips/
Posted: 05:27 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
Juan Rivera re-signs with the Angels for 3 years, $12.75 million.
Posted: 05:28 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Don M
I can’t complain at all when a players takes the most money to go play somehwere.. If Howard wants to try to get paid $20 M a season.. and somebody is willing to pay him that, good for him
Posted: 05:30 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Evrybuddy Hits woohoo
Howard wants too much otherwise he would be signed long-term. Puljos signed a 7 year, $100 million contract 4 years ago. Howard is worth about $15 million per year over 5 to 6 years. But no way is he worth $20 million or higher per year.
Posted: 05:32 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Andrew R.
All I know is, Howard bitched when he was GIVEN $900K after winning ROY. He got the same amount that Pujols got after his first season, and Pujols actually had more service time. So in actuality, Howard ended up getting paid more for doing less.
Howard wants to make more than Pujols? That seems to be the story, well, tough shit. Pujols hits .350, strikes out only 50 times a year AND plays a Gold- Glove first base.
Come on, Howard had his chance at a long-term deal, but wanted to see what arbitration would bring. That’s fine. We’ll play that game for as long as we can, but now go out and see what kind of ‘Mega-deal” you’ll get when you do become a FA, at the age of 33. Look how hard it is for the FA’s today to get big deals (Burrell, Bradley, Manny, etc. etc.). And I’m sure Howard’s defense will only decline. Big guys tend to decline very quickly, ie. Cecil Fielder.
So let him go. He’ll get some good amounts in arbitration, but nowhere near what he would have gotten if accepted a deal. Look at Dustin Pedroia. He’s a ROY, and MVP as well. Look what he accepted. 6-years, $44M? Come on. That’s a guy who wants to stay with a team and win. I would take Pedroia over Howard any day (and let Utley play first).
Posted: 05:58 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 john of Albuquerque
You can find fault with Howard, but he is the most productive hitter in baseball based on home runs and RBI’s the past three years. Also, he was ROY four years ago. He has been stellar despite the strikeouts and the fielding. It would be a real shame if we do not reward this player this year. He deserves to be one of the top ten paid players in all of baseball. THe facts are the facts.
Posted: 06:04 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Chuck P
Maaann… this is turraable (my best best impression of Sir Charles on paper).
I think that Howard gets a bad rap on here. Yes, he strikes out but that’s what power hitters do… they hit homeruns and they strike out. His objective is to hit one out every time he steps to the plate… he could bunt down third baseline and get on base but who would that be helping? He rarely sees anything above the shins… there aren’t many hitters that are feared the way he is feared and I think that his skills cannot be replaced for $15 million per year. Find me a free agent that’s going to hit that many HR’s or drive in that many runs for $15 million… Pat was making $14 million! In each of his first three full seasons, Howard has been first or second in HR and RBI and at bats per HR in the NL. If his objective is to hit HR’s and drive in runs, he’s clearly more successful at doing that than anyone else in in the NL. $20 million sounds like a lot but contract values go up… that’s the way it works… he’s going to make over $15 million via arbitration. I say, pay the man his money. But we won’t. We’re worried about nickles and dimes.
Posted: 06:07 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Phil
Is Charles Barkley for real? Does he even watch baseball? Howard isn’t even the best player on his team let alone top 10 in baseball. Here are all of the players about as good or better than Howard and I will exclude pitchers and stick to position players. I’m also taking defense into account when I make this list. I am also taking into account that short stops don’t tend to hit home runs, so I’m trying to make home runs a factor for the position. ie Hanley hit 30 last year as a short stop which would equate to much higher if he was a big time slugging 1st baseman.
Chase Utley
Jimmy Rollins
Jose Reyes
David Wright
Chipper Jones
Hanley Ramirez
Lance Berkman
Ryan Braun
Albert Pujols
Manny Ramirez
Adrian Gonzales
A-Rod
Mark Teixera
David Ortiz
Dustin Pedroia
Derek Jeter was up until the 08 season
Evan Longoria
Carlos Quentin
Justin Morneau
Joe Mauer
Brian McCann
Miguel Cabrera
Magglio Ordonez
Pudge was until about 2 years ago
Josh Hamilton
Matt Holliday
Ichiro Suzuki
Vlad Guerrero
Here’s my list dispute all you’d like.
Posted: 06:16 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NJ
By now a clucking crack addict is more credible than Charles Barkley.
As for Howard I love the guy but he’s putting dollar signs before performance and that hurts the team. He’s an undeniable talent but he is either poorly prepared or is incapable of making adjustments. I would love to see him take on the mindset of Albert Pujols, A-Rod or Tex and dedicate himself to becoming a truely great player but he’s got a chip on his shoulder that makes him shoot for glory in every AB. If he takes the steps to become a better hitter then lets hope the FO takes the ultimate risk and gives him his big money deal, problem is right now he’s heading in the direction of Aubrey Huff not Albert Pujols and if he wants to be a HOFer he better sort his game and act like he cares.
Posted: 06:19 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
Other than Carlos Quentin, Morneau, Ichiro and Vlad, I have to agree with you. I still appreciate Howard for what he does: murder right-handed pitching, but he’s a DH who becomes a below average hitter against lefties. But man, does he kill righties.
Posted: 06:19 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NJ
He kills lefties too (when he makes contact) but his ego inflated by the press’s love for big homerun numbers masks his pitiful all-around performance that could very easily result in a Travis Hafner like fall.
Posted: 06:23 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Phil
To Chuck P…RBIs are a team stat. Put Howard on the Padres and see how many RBIs he can get. That’s why Adrian Gonzales impressed me so much last year. Also, put Howard in that stadium. He’s not hitting 50 home runs. Put Adrian Gonzales in our stadium and he’ll hit close to 50. He also plays a well above average 1st base. Howard isn’t even in the top 5 1st basemans. Pujols, Berkman, Tex, Gonzales, and Morneau are better. I’ll even say that Howard is tied for 5th with Morneau. Fielder and Pena come in at a close 6th though.
Posted: 06:23 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Tools of Ignorance
Honestly, this past year for Howard really wasn’t anything special….I’ll admit I was never a huge Howard fan, but I’ll give a guy his due if it’s deserved….That being said, Howard had just one (1) good month this past season, he shouldn’t even get a raise in my opinion.
I’ll even say that for the 1st half the season, you had Pat being far more dominant that Howard was….(I was also never a huge pat fan)
Posted: 06:25 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Phil
Griffin I’ll give you Quentin because he’s new to the league, but how is Morneau not as good as Howard and how are Ichiro and Vlad not better? Look at their career stats.
Posted: 06:26 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Manny
Don’t want people to start yelling at me… BUT…
Seeing Rivera go for 4M per year (3 year contract), I’m definitely thinking that we should’ve done: LOWE and RIVERA. Overall, it seems about as expensive as MOYER and IBAÑEZ. And I’d take the first duo over the second in a heartbeat.
Posted: 06:26 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Manny
That said, I’m already an Ibañez fan.. but what happened to pitching being our priority??
Posted: 06:27 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Eb
it was well known after last season that Howard was seeking 20 mil a season.
Posted: 06:29 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NJ
Manny I think we all agree the first pair would have been preferential but it clearly wasn’t a do-able deal.
Posted: 06:30 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
Phil, interesting that you should compare him to Adrian Gonzalez. I read an article last year that compared the two players and how close they were but how far their public perception differed. Gonzalez is a very good fielder as well.
Most people are ‘old school’ and look at HR, RBI and BA to determine what players are good. RBI and Wins for pitchers are probably the two most faulty stats when determining a player’s value. They are dependent upon the team and situation, etc.
Posted: 06:32 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NJ
Howard acts like the Babe at a time he’s not the best at his position let alone in a class a mile above the rest like Babe Ruth was. His attitude is pay me, I’ll do the dance if I get lucky but I don’t love the game that much.
Posted: 06:33 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Geoff
I agree manny, though i dont think its wise to spend money on FA pitching because its overpriced, i DO believe that amaro should be burning the phone lines to try and upgrade myers’ spot in teh rotation. maybe you trade myers and add prospects to the deal to get a better guy in teh 2 slot, perhaps undcer contract longer, via trade…thats what amaro should be doing now…
i do liek the ibanez move…park is ok for hte middle relief work. moyer is a 5….happ will leapfrog him in teh rotation this year..
Posted: 06:35 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Geoff
moyer was great last y ear but i just cant rely on him to do that every year…if he does then geart but you have to have someone ready in case he goes…and they do, to their credit, carrasco is ready….
Posted: 06:36 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Manny
NJ… I don’t understand. Why not? Rivera didn’t want to play here? Because of Lowe? I think 16M per year should get him anyway (that’s overpaying, still) and with Rivera 4M (maybe 5M)… it’s approx the same as Moyer (6.5-10M) and Ibañez (10.5M)… and I’m not even mentioning Chan Ho Park.
Posted: 06:37 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Don M
it blows my mind that Pujols makes $100 M over 7 years… and that’s underpaid by today’s standards..
When Burrell signed his deal in 2002 it was like 6 years, $50 M or something and that was a MONSTER contract.. this stuff has gotten way out of hand.
Middle of the road pitchers like Livan Hernandez, Carlos Silva, Vincente Padilla, Randy Wolf.. should not get piad $10 M a year to do anything..
Posted: 06:44 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Geoff
i agree…thats why i stay away from FA starting pitching….trading is the way to go….and of coiurse, growing yoru own..
Posted: 06:45 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NJ
Manny I would have been critical if the Phils had shown no interest in Lowe but Amaro confirmed interest which was heavily reported and not being on the inside I believe there’s a reason the chips have fallen in this way. I’m assuming Lowe was un-signable and it’s not above Boras to use a club to drive up the price without having any intention his client signing, Lowe has been a bad attitude guy in the past and I’d rather be in the position we are now than that of the Mets or Brewers having to try and fill holes without the money or getting burned like the Braves.
Posted: 06:47 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 NJ
The problem we have is Pujols plays the game to get paid whereas Howard uses his salary number as a status marker, he doesn’t care the number he makes so much as it’s setting record numbers and he isn’t THAT good.
Posted: 06:50 PM on December 19, 2008
Posts: 0 Griffin
Phil, Morneau is debatable, but he’s a terrible fielder as well. He’s comparable to Howard (less power, but more contact). Ichiro and Vlad have had HOF careers, but I wouldn’t take them over Howard RIGHT NOW. Career-wise, they are HOFers.
Posted: 06:53 PM on December 19, 2008