Ryan Howard: $18M, Phillies: $14M

Posted by Tim Malcolm, Tue, January 20, 2009 05:25 PM | Comments: 78
Arbitration, Posts

Ryan Howard asked for $18 million in arbitration today. It’s the third-highest figure asked by a player since arbitration began, and by far, the largest asking price of the season (Prince Fielder is second at $8M).

The Phillies are offering Howard $14 million.

This might be negotiable. But then again …

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  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Has anyone seen the numbers for Jayson Werth or Joe Blanton? Wonder if they are working on longer deals for those guys than just the 1yr..

  • Posts: 0 T Marty

    i just saw Blanton, one year, $5.475 million

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    That seems like a whole lot of money to me…

  • Posts: 0 Keith

    $18 mil! No way he’s worth that much. What will he ask for in his final year of arbitration, $30? Time to think about saying good bye.

  • Posts: 0 Manny

    From the other post:

    Apparently Howard is not in the same sync as his teammates… Maybe he just thinks that he’s too special?? $14M is more than enough. Enough with this $18M BS. His demands are simply ridiculous.

    Dennis: Giving him respect does not mean throw money at him. I’ll give him respect once he shows humbleness and learns something from Cole and Co.

  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    If he cut down the strikeouts and wasn’t a detriment defensively at first base he might be worth 15 mil. 18 mil is just rediculous

  • Posts: 0 cm

    Werth is asking $4 million, Phillies want to give him $3 million. Durbin wants $1.95 mil, but the Phillies want $1.35 mil.

  • Posts: 0 BrianD

    the time to move Howard passed when the Yankees signed Tex and Sox signed Youk. Whoever trades for him would have to be able to sign him long term. Is that even possible with Howard?

  • Posts: 0 Bryan Howard

    “the time to move Howard passed when the Yankees signed Tex ”


    Ryan Howard is a DH. He can’t play 1st!

  • Posts: 0 Grrrumpy Miner

    Is it me or was it recently Philly Phans LOVED and REVERED Ryan Howard.Now most of you want to basically run him out of town on a rail.Ryan Howard no matter what he is on the field is a dangerous presence at the dish and helped the Phils when it mattered the most.As an Amazins fan,I’m scared of him whenever he faces us because he’s that damn good and has my respect as a player.Just remember that you don’t know what you got til its gone.

  • Posts: 0 Georgie

    Are you forgetting we already lost Pat the Bat, who had 33 HRs and 86rbi , who we replaced with Ibanez, who had 100 more at bats than Pat and 10 less HR’s? Now you want to get rid of Howard and lose his close to 50 HR’s and 150 rbi? That’s alot of power gone from the lineup. I think we take for granted that with those two guys there’s always the chance they might win a game for you with one mighty swing, tough to replace that, especially for cheap.

    Miner, “you don’t know what you got til it’s gone” -words of wisdom, great tune too!

  • Posts: 0 Howard

    If Mr. Howard could learn to field and show a little more patience at the plate, MAYBE he would be worth $14m. However, that’s even a stretch. No one is worth that amount of cash. Would it be difficult to replace his bat, yes. But not impossible. It would take some time. I think it’s time to start planning for his replacement.

  • Posts: 0 Jason B.

    I have to say that I see this as the beginning of the end for Howard. There is something seriously wrong with the world when a 4 mil/yr raise is not enough. He is worth 14 mil, sure, but 18 mil… NO WAY!!! His fielding skills are deplorable and he should get traded to the AL.

  • Posts: 0 christopher

    might be negotiable, but after last arbitration it was obvious that this was going to be the routine for the rest of howard’s time here in philly. if they go again, the phils might actually win this time. no big whoop either way.

  • Posts: 0 Andrew R.

    Well, we sure will miss him when he’s gone. But let’s just enjoy the big man while we have him. I will say that he will definately NOT get what he is seeking. It is just way too much. If he hit .313 like his MVP year, than maybe. But the fact that he took the first 5 months off and salvaged the season in Sept. no way. His HR’s and RBI’s, especially in our ballpark, are misleading statistics. Put him out in PETCO park with that lineup and he wouldn’t have those numbers. He’d still be feared and be in the upper tier of players, but not the 50 HR, 140 rbi guy we know and love.

    Forget the Yanks and Red Sox, exploit the stupid teams like: the Orioles, Giants, Rangers, Mariners, etc. Some team will be on the cusp at the deadline maybe not in 2009, but in 2010, that will give up the world for him, unless of course this is his last year as a Phillie. I don’t see why we can’t have either Dominic Brown or Michael Taylor learn to play 1st in a few years. Who knows? That’s why Ruben gets paid the big bucks.

    He will not get $18M. That’s almost double his salary, and this year was definately a step backwards. No way!! Sorry Ryan.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Well theyve got Blanton and Vic taken care of for a year. Now the question is does Werth get a one year deal or an extension?

    once they take care of that, its all down to Howard and will they decide to make the move and get rid of him. I say yes…trade him. Get some good prospects, replace him with Dunn.

  • Posts: 0 Andrew R.

    Here’s something for fun…. Phillies trade Howard for big chips and sign Manny. Ibanez moves to first. Imagine that. Could Ibanez be any worse at first than Howard? I doubt it. So what it comes down to is Manny instead of Howard. I’d take that over the next 2-3 years any day. What would we get for Howard? I’ll take a Rollins-Werth-Utley-Manny-Ibanez-Victorino lineup. That’s balance. No holes there whatsoever.

  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    I think Ibanez HR per plate appearence will be similar to Pat’s in CBP(not per AB, but per appearence). 18 million for 200 KO’s, no range and a poor glove is too much, but 14 mil was low balling again. I would’ve went 15.5 and I think the would’ve won. Now it’s a crap shoot. Definately his last year in Philly.

  • Posts: 0 Howard

    Andrew – I don’t know if we’d put up with “Manny being Manny”. It’d be a show at first, but after a few “missed” plays, he wouldn’t be able to take the heat. We wouldn’t put up with his antics.

  • Posts: 0 Phil

    Andrew R…I 100% agree with you.

  • Posts: 0 Phil

    I don’t know about you, Howard but if Manny drops a simple fly ball then walks up to the dish and knocks in a game winning home run then all will be forgiven.

  • Posts: 0 Joe O'Phillie

    $18 million would put him in the top 5. From his perspective, he is a top 5 talent. He is the best power hitter in baseball. However, he loses points due to his low batting average and terrible fielding. Puljos made less than $14 million last year. I think the Phils win this round.

    Whatever you do, don’t trade Howard now. Let’s ride this boy to another championship or two while we have him.

  • Posts: 0 Howard

    Agreed, since we have him until 2011.

  • Posts: 0 ActuallyChilled

    I would settle for something in between on Howard. we know that when he’s on, he’s on, and can strike fear in opposing pitchers. he is part of the championship team, and to subtract his presence might alter the chemistry… ‘if it ain’t broken, don’t fix it…?’

    its not time to let him out of here, at least yet. let him take any selfish-based anger out on the ball, if thats possible, and let’s the world series rings drop down as they may.

    Everyone wants to talk about his low batting average, like its the worst issue, and place him in Dunn territory as a result. those of you might be forgetting that BA with runners in scoring position is key for someone in the middle of a lineup, and Howard’s average in such situations was well over .300 if I recall correctly, close to the top; whereas, Dunn continues to blow. Thats what matters: he’s freakin’ clutch. There is no doubt about that. and his September numbers, a ‘salvage’? Gimme a break. thats doubles his clutch value.

    Anyway, whatever happens, he’ll be in Philly this next season. Amaro wouldn’t dare move him. Too much risk to his legacy. If they don’t win the world series again and Howard is gone this season, Amaro will be blamed as the cause of failure. I doubt he’ll take that risk.

  • Posts: 0 Phil

    I’d rather have Dunn and Lowe for $20 million a year next year than Howard for $18 million a year. That’s just me though.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    I agree except Lowe was too old to give that money to. Its Dunn and Sheets. Thats what theyve gotta do, thats the smart move. Ryan Howard is gone and Im going to be happy. We won a world title with him, now its time for him to go get his money elsewhere and the phillies will go win another world championship without him. Oh yes. its time. Ruben is just getting warmed up.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    I know it may not be likely but I want him gone, hes WAY out of line and hes being disrespectful and hes gotta go.

  • Posts: 0 Andrew R.

    Howard, yes Manny being Manny is part of the BS that comes with it. As long as Manny is happy, he is fine. This is a team where he doesnt have to be the big guy. I think he will understand his role and not really need to draw attention to himself. He was great in LA. He hit the ball, mentored the young kids a little bit and was a leader on the field. All he has to do here is come out and play. We have leaders, we have stars, all we need is a stick.

    His ‘missed plays’ cannot be any worse than Burrell’s crappy play. Even though he made few errors last year, any decent high school OF would have played a better LF. I would take Ibanez and Manny over Pat and Howard. Assuming defense is about the same for the 2 (with Ibanez at 1st), I’ll take the two that have .290 and .320 career averages over the two .250 averages. Oh and the combined strikeout totals would be about 150 less. Imagine that.

    Again, it was just a fun thought. No way to Dunn. crap.

  • Posts: 0 Bruce

    Just last year, the Phillies front office and some fans here thought $10M was too much for Howard. Of course, the panel of arbitrators took one look at his achievements (for 2007) and thought otherwise. Now the front office upped their offer this year to $14M. Guess what, The arbitrators will decide in Howard’s favor again ($18M). Nothing the Phils can do with that when he is asking for breaking records every year (2nd year in a row in leading majors in RBIs and HRs and finishing a close second for MVP)).

    If only, the Phillies had the foresight to sign him to a multi-year contract LAST year. All that money that could have been saved from his arbitration years and now must pay the price.

  • Posts: 0 John J

    this is what you get when you pay a guy 999,000.00. that was a slap in the face and now he’s making the phils pay. karma is a …….

  • Posts: 0 JSmith

    All I have to say is keep Manny outta Philly. I think Manny is fine right where he’s at. I couldn’t tell you who would be a perfect replacement for Howard but feel another strong starting pitcher would not have been a bad idea. I can’t see Howard being around for more than 2 seasons though. I guess they could always charge $15 for a beer, $12 for a hot dog and hats could easily go up to $40. (sarcasm)

  • Posts: 0 BrianD

    I wish I had the balls to turn down a 40% raise and say you know what I need an 80% raise this year……..

    Especially in light of the fact that one of the simplest parts of my job I suck at (throws to 2nd).
    If I’m the GM I use him up this year and see what we can do next off season.

  • Posts: 0 scott

    i say we trade howard now for a right handed power 3b and sign adam dunn to play first whom we can give about 10 mil less than howard. if you think about it dunn is about the same player he may not hit as many hr as howard but the threat of him going deep every pitch is there plus the both strike out all the time wont be anything new to us.. i just cant see paying a guy that much money who cant hit an off speed pitch to save his life

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    For what its worth… Howard is no A-rod, or Pujols, or whatever… but Adam Dunn sure ain’t Ryan Howard either

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Daily News has the projected payroll between $132 M and $136 M depending on Howard’s arbitration number.

    We still owe $3 M to Thome…. EATON is $8.5 M, and JENKINS is $6.75 M

    My point last year was that if you totaled the numbers you got from Werth and Jenkins, you had one hell of a RF, but now that the total salary for those two climsb to $10 M, it looks worse

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    I don’t know that Werth would/should sign an extension for what the Phillies want to pay him.. he’s a 5-tool player, and lots of teams would want him, Mets included… he could get AT LEAST $5-6 M a season for a 3 or 4 year deal, if the Phillies are only looking at $3 M per season, even $4… They’d offer a 3 year/$12 M contract… chances are he’d laugh at that

    it needs to be at least 3yr/$15 M in my mind

  • Posts: 0 Richie

    Okay guys, I know Ryan Howards don’t grow on trees and we will never replace his bat in the lineup and all that, but money doesn’t grow on trees either and we do not have the money to pay him if we are going to contiuously add key pieces to the puzzle every year like we have. Ruben has the next two years to find a viable replacement and get the most for him. Bye Ryan, it is a shame you can’t be satisfied with like 16 mil for 4 years, but no your bill at McDonald’s wont be covered with that. Although I love seeing you swing through horrible pitches and kick balls around theinfield every night, you do erupt the stadium like no other. There is no denying that. I know. Happy Trails Ryno!

  • [...] the masses at Phillies Nation, Beerleaguer, The Good Phight and The Level all seem to agree that the number is out of line. [...]

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    check cots baseball contracts..i think their debt to thome is paid now. bringing in dunn around 8mm, and sheets 6-8m base with incentives up to 14 basically covers the howard money..shedding his salary could go a long way. If youre worried about cutting payroll Howards the guy that goes, brett myers is after him (but if you could afford to keep myers id hang onto him another year and offer him a hometown discount to resign next year if he finally is the consistent starter hes supposed to be – if he struggles again – seya pal)

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Do you know how bad are team becomes if the center of your lineup has Adam Dunn instead of Ryan Howard…

    Sheets isn’t coming here, lets stop that talk now… I’ll quit posting on here for a month if we sign Ben Sheets.

    No wonder athletes in Philadelphia hate it here… imagine if any of them ever read this page, and what “the real fans” think…

  • Posts: 0 Georgie

    Jeez, I brought up Dunn months ago as a replacement for Pat, and everyone acted like I was retarded or something, and bringing in Manny, are you kidding? Are you forgetting that he intentionally dogged it in Boston just because he was sick of being there? I want NO parts of someone like that on this team, we have too many young guys he could have a negative influence on, we are not that desperate.

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Hamels doesn’t mind Howard asking for $18 M…. “He can change the game with one swing of the bat.”


  • Posts: 0 Georgie

    No matter what network you watch, NFL, MLB, Fox, ESPN, someone always brings up the fans in Philly, how tough they are, how much they boo. It usually ticks me off, but when I see people on here say they would boo ANYONE on a championship team, I just feel it brings shame to the fans and the city. McNabb is another example, I know he whines alot, but for those who want him out of here, who the hell do you get to replace him, it ain’t that easy! If the Eagles FO would listen to him and get a WR, FB, RB, anything to help him out, the haters might feel differently. I’m digressing, but let’s try to keep the hating and booing to a minimum, we are talking about the WS champs, right?

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    …bad OUR* team becomes…

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Ryan Howard is a negative influence…arrogant greedy player who thinks hes greater than the game…and if we dont need players like that on our team (manny ramirez) then we dont need ryan howard because he IS one of those turd guys.

    Adam Dunns numbers were not that much worse than howards. i mean, theyre close enough to NOT pay howard the 14m let alone 18m and go for the cheaper option.

    dunn: 40HR 100 RBI .236 AVG
    howard: 48HR 146 RBI .251 AVG

    howards are clealry better but theyre not 10 million dollars better than dunns…so i dont wanna hear it. if howard leaves chase utley raul ibanez jimmy rollins and shane victorino would be the focal points of the offense as it would be a contact hitting team. dunn would be there for extra power.

    Then you bring in sheets because he is worth the risk. they risked it with adam eaton so not risking it with sheets is foolish. The rotation is good enough that you can AFFORD to take the risk and not be SCREWED if it doesnt work out…which is precisely why you take the risk. i dont even consider jamie moyer a known quantity in this rotation whatsoever at all in any way. you cant honeslty say you have ANY idea what youre going to get from him. two season ago he was FLAT OUT horrible, last season he was great…so what this time?

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    actually you know what? forget adam dunn…still, im not enthusiastic at all about keeping ryan howard here with his attitude. i dont even want to look at him anymore because of that level of greed and arrogance. its all about money and greed when youre haggling over a few million and you ALREADY have millions in the bank. thats insulting and putrid….

  • Posts: 0 Richie

    Make no mistake about it, this Phillies team will be cheered unmercifully this entire year. Win, lose, or draw (I say this with my foot already in mouth, haha). No, seriously, Utley, Hamels, Myers, Blanton, Ruiz, Werth, Vic, will all get the praise they rightfully deserve as the first champs of most of our lifetime, but I don’t care what you do in Philly, if you do something to rub our faces in the snow like what Howard is doing, he is gonna get booed if he slips up. You want 18 mil, now your smackin your blue collar fans in the face and sayin I am higher than this team, screw you! So, with that comes the territory, but everyone else will be worshiped. Ryan, you made your bed now lie in it!

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Geoff…”Ryan Howard is a negative influence”

    says who, you? His teammates sure seem to love him… but if you don’t like him because he wants to get paid a lot of money, the Phillies should listen to you .. you had lots of great ideas about which players to trade last year, Rollins, Howard, Madson (or did you want Madson released outright, I forget)..

    give it a rest dude… he’s ASKING for $18 M…. he never said he’s going to sit out if he doesn’t get paid that much, he’s just asking for that much because he looks at the list of players who make more than that and realizes he’s better than most of them. The fact that there are also players better than Howard that make less then he does gives the Phillies leverage too… none of that means that you should trade Howard because of what he asked in arbitration.

    sometimes, my blood pressure goes through the roof reading posts on this site

  • Posts: 0 Don M

    This list if from David Murphy (philly.com High Cheese)

    Ten players currently have contracts whose average annual value is $18 million or greater:

    Alex Rodriguez, NYY 2008-17 $27,500,000

    CC Sabathia, NYY 2009-15 $23,000,000

    Johan Santana, NYM 2008-13 $22,916,667

    Miguel Cabrera, Det 2008-15 $19,037,500

    Derek Jeter, NYY 2001-10 $18,900,000

    Carlos Zambrano, Cubs 2008-12 $18,300,000

    Andruw Jones, LAD 2008-09 $18,100,000

    Vernon Wells, Tor 2008-14 $18,000,000

    Barry Zito, SF 2007-13 $18,000,000

    Ichiro Suzuki, Sea 2008-12 $18,000,000

    Torri Hunter, LAA 2008012 $18,000,000

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    that list don…how many good contracts are on that list? ZERO…bruce was talking about giving him 18 20 and 22 m in an escalating 3 year deal…thats horrible! nobodys worth that much money…tori hunter worth 18m? HAHAHA NO WAY…if you want to pay howard that type of money then go ahead…and yes, im putting words in your mouth and im just going to go ahead and SAY that you want to give him that deal too even though you probably dont…

    BUT…its time to give the phillies preemptive credit for signing Jayson Werth to a multiyear deal. NICE! Im interested to see what numbers he gets…

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