Phillies Nation

woooord! nasty… my guess: 136 m if it happens.

I think we have already seen the best Howard has to offer. I would love for him to sign a long term deal and prove me wrong but I don’t see it. I would give him 4 years max.

I’m all about trading Howard to the Yankees for Wang and Nady then moving Ibanez to 1B and signing Manny, but I’d make the Yankees pay Wang and Nady’s contracts.

I agree with Ed, that four years should be tops. Also, I would suggest a contract heavily laden with incentives that allows him to make $20 million a year if he hits key goals –reduced strikeouts, increased batting average, 45 plus home runs, games played (140). I would also stick with a base of $12 million. This is one of many reasons I am not a general manager.

I guarantee they will make the playoffs this year without howard. last year is last year, this year…guaranteed theyll make the playoffs unless amaro makes a horrible abreu-esque trade. if they make a good trade then things will be fine…

There is just no reason to deal him now.. and especially if all you’d get in return is a non-Ace/above average pitcher WANG, and a journeyman outfielder NADY..

We need our record-setting cleanup hitter, much more than anything the Yankees would be willing to give up.

since the mets resigned oliver perez, theyll now have him and johan santana to strike out ryan howard every time again. and if they were smart theyd sign a TERRIBLE middle relief pitcher whos left handed but whos smart enough to throw sliders to ryan howard. and that bum will strike out ryan howard every single time he faces him, whoever it may be…

i didnt call him a bum..i said hed get repeatedly struck out by a bum…

actually im quite happy…im pretty sure that Amaro could construct a far better team with 18M extra to worth with than to just have to give it all to ryan howard…he already turned down very lucrative contract offers…so whats the point of keeping around a negative, selfish, greedy player who doesnt really want to be here? i mean…weve seen how taht turned out before (T.O., Lindros) Ryan Howard compares PERFECTLY to Eric Lindros. The only difference between the two is that the Phillies had more parts around howard to lift him up than the flyers ever had around Lindros.

Anything around 138/7 and considering what’s likely to happen with his demands the Phils will be making off like bandits. I’m in favour of dealing him to rise to a potentially top 3 system considering you’d pretty much guarantee a 25/80 replacement at the very least and improve everywhere else on the field going forward. I know it’s a different situation but I don’t think the Indians are looking back with Sabathia when they look at LaPorta and the Rangers certainly aren’t missing Tex when they look at Salty/Perez. That said signing him to a long-term deal is likely to boost the clubhouse whereas dealing at a time the organisations flying high would errode the clubhouse aura.

Muts sign Ollie Perez 3yr/$36 million. $12 mil a year for him? Why not just go out and get Derek Lowe for a little more?

The Mets got blindsided by the Braves for Lowe, no-one saw the Braves coming to the point the Mets got caught posturing without a footing to up the ante without it backfiring.

Would rather the Mets re-sgn Perez than add Abreu.

I cannot beleive Oliver Perez got 12M a year. thats DESPERATE….Yea the braves came out of nowhere to get lowe and forced them to make this overvalued pricing of oliver perez.

now..trying to extend howard is pretty much a waste at this point unless a dramatic change occurs..is he WAS going to listen, i really cant see why an updated version (beefed up a tad) of utleys contract was really taht insulting to him. i think the phillies made their best offer already, and i doubt much will come out of this new round of talk other than trade demands and trash talking through the media…

Let me apologize for Geoff’s comments… he has personal issues with Ryan Howard. Either that, or he must have been hibernating when the Phillies were playing meaningful games in September/October because in those months, the guy that Geoff laughably compares to Eric Lindros has carried us. Howard’s career numbers in September and October look something like this: .317, 91 R, 44 HR, 111 RBI, .435 OBP, .716 SLG, 136 OPS+… incredible.

Your guarantee is absurd. I guarantee that if we didn’t have Ryan Howard in September, we wouldn’t have made it into the playoffs… I guarantee that Xavier Nady is not worthy of carrying Ryan Howard’s jock (there ya go Don). I guarantee that even adding CM Wang to our rotation is not going to be enough to get us back. Adding those two players is not going to get us back. If you take Howard out of this lineup, it becomes pedestrian. We would go from having three consistent 30 HR hitters (Howard, Burrell and Utley) to one… and he’s not even healthy. But hey, we would be lucky, right? I mean Xavier Nady is coming off of a career year… .305, 25HR, 97 RBI and 76 R… tell me where you’re going to make up those extra 39 RBI and 29 R? And Howard had a bit of an off year, didn’t he?

I’d still like to see us make a play for Sheets inspite of the health worries. The Utley deal was good for both sides, renewed talks with Howard just seems like going through the motions, he’s not keep to get a deal done like Pujols was.

I wonder what Sheets is going to get. I think he’s looking for two years.

The Howard debate just gives me headaches, so I’m staying far away.

NJ is right… if you trade Howard, you had better improve your farm DRAMATICALLY; you trade Howard to secure the future but when that happens, it means that we are turning the page on this team and I’m not ready to do that. Subtract Howard and we don’t have enough. PERIOD. Championship teams don’t come around too often and every part is essential. Why do you think the Red Sox didn’t make it?? I suspect that losing Manny Ramirez might have had something to do with them not finishing strong… and the Red Sox got some pretty good replacements, didn’t they?

Geoff, all you do is run your mouth. He’s given most of us Phillies fans (except for you) no “absolute” reason that he doesn’t want to play in Philadelphia anymore. We all have our qualms with players sometimes, but all I read on your part is total trash. If all you want to keep saying is that Howard is like Eric Lindros, then you might as well find a better time rolling up a joint on a 1996 Philadelphia Phillies program, remembering what it was like to be a fan during a time of actual hopelessness. You got anything better to do with your time than come on here day in and day out and trash our team? He deserves more than what Burrell made last year. And so what, he has high ambitions in both the game and in the business. Stop trying to tell us that Howard is different than most players. He’s not. He’s a man who wants to have job security. He’s a man who wants another shot to win a championship. He’s a man who wants to put up monster numbers in his career so people will remember him in the future. He wants to be a face of the game and a face for his team. He helped win us a championship, and I will be grateful for his talent until the day I die.

Listen, I’m not the leader of the Ryan Howard fanclub or anything but I swear that Geoff wakes up, grabs his coffee (black, of course) and thinks about ways to knock this kid… and all Howard has done is produce. I think that we should be careful crafting any sort of long-term deal with Howard because he is approaching 30… not a great age for large sluggers. Options, incentives and contingencies for both sides…. I do think that he will have to work extra-hard to get back to where he was two and three seasons ago (less strikeouts and more opposite field HR) and not allow his age to be a factor but considering what he has done so far, why would you question whether he is made out of the material that allows guys to overcome adversity? What makes you think that he won’t work hard to do what needs to be done?? ROY, MVP, SS and runner-up MVP… those are my reasons for thinking that he can. Money aside, why do you believe that he can’t? And if money is your only argument, then I suggest you leave that for the arbitrators, agents and GM’s to figure out and appreciate him as a Phillies phan.

Let me say up front I am a Lidge fan. Howard is great, but not my guy. That being said, I must dissent from others. Howard NEEDS this long-term deal and the Phillies should give it to him. I apologize to those who say he should go, but I believe the Phillies were the world **** champs because of Howard (as well as many others – but primarily Howard). I believe if we want to see world **** champs again, sign him and sign him yesterday. How much? Not Texeria (sp?) or CC money, but close.

I can understand the people that don’t like Howard… I’m not particularly fond of the way he carries himself, either… I just don’t understand how a Phillies Phan could say that losing Howard by itself is a good thing. Living in this town and rooting for this team, how can you not appreciate what he has done?

NOBODY is saying taht the city doesnt appreciate what he has done. thats NOT the point. The point is that weve gotten great things out of him, he cant see eye to eye with the front office anymore and he carries himself like hes God’s gift to baseball, which doesnt resonate well with people who work hard for a living IN THE BEGINNING THROWS OF A DEPRESSION.

So when it comes to that point you realize hes not going to be here so you try and make the best deal you can to improve your farm system and add an impact player to your current roster. If he wants that money, fine, but BOTH sides – as well as the fans – know he wont get it here. And i seriously doubt the Phillies will pay him the 18M if they lose at the hearing. Theyll ship him out of here so fast itll make your head spin…

I say the phils should trade howard when he has one arb yr left for prospects. Power hitting first baseman aren’t hard to find. And guys like howard usually start to decline around age 32, 33. being that he is what 29? I think we should get rid of him after this yr.

Trade Howard and rebuild? Bolderdash! Trade Howard and RELOAD! Howard is a charismatic power hitter. But he:

1. Costs you 50 runs a year in the field AT LEAST. His defense is THAT terrible. Watching him try to field often makes me sick;
2. He can’t move a runner unless its via a home run;
3. He clogs up the basepaths;
4. He strikes out too much.

When he is cold, the offense doesn’t work. And we lose. He’s the black Dave Kingman. Trade him for Ryan Zimmerman +.

Lets say for sake of argument here is he gets the 18 million this year. What if he gets hurt and can’t [;ay for a few months of next year. Does anyone think that he is going to get less money the following year? Absolutely not. Once he gets it in arbitration he will never make less. And if he is hurt is he worth a raise? I think it would be a wse move to trade him depending on what is available at the time.