Phillies Nation

Now if they can do it at home…

Guess which starter in Phillies rotation has the most wins and innings pitched? Guess which pitcher has seven straight starts of 6 innings or more? Name the pitcher that has 6 quality starts so far for the Phillies?
;-)

Sorry that my boy is such a p u

The Phils really need to remove those World Series Champions patches from their home jerseys. This patch is not present on the road. Ah, superstitions…

the official scorer at tropicana field is an absolute disgrace. giving errors on two plays on balls hit my Jimmy Rollins which were clearly hard hit balls that I had no doubt in my mind should have been scored as hits. this was all in order to protect David Price and keep his ERA down. This meant only 5 earned runs were charged to Price instead of 10. sorry to be off point, but this is just one of the little things in the game that drive me crazy.

The Phils don’t do anything by half now do they…

Moyer gets such a bad rep because admittedly he is only a 6 inning pitcher, but give him something to work with and he teaches the guys around him how you can get through a start sensibly. Great job from the two relievers, making the best of easy innings has to be the backbone of a bullpen. The roster management can be criticised this year, but I think the personnel guys hae done a good job using the injury replacement relievers (And Happ/Park).

Man, I was listening on the way home from work. I went to 5 of the 9 home games vs those brutes from the AL. Every game there was rain and every game there was a loss – it was ugly all around. The first thought was “damn them!” but I realized I was just so happy to see that the offense was not dead it was hard to be mad –
Good to see Chase Utley and co. back in form!

Good company, a few Amstels, some burgs on the grille and a big win by the Phils – I’m happy!

I especially enjoyed the the radio call’s “keys to the game”. There was only one key, and it was “get on the plane”.

I just don’t understand this team.

It’s Moyer and it’s not a bad thing, he has to paint the corners and stay away from contact as much as possible so his pitch count tends to limit him to 6 innings. That’s why you carry guys like Park, Durbin and now Tyler Walker who can give you multiple innings.

When the offense doesn’t give Moyer something to work with the Phils are forced to burn the better relievers to stay in the game except last night with some (charitable use of the word) support you saw Moyer’s bread and butter, 6 strong innings and then 3 easy innings for the pen.

Of course your going to hold your breath with Moyer, who isn’t when Myers or Hamels has started this year. A quality start isn’t a dubious stat because we really under-appreciate how hard it is to pitch in this league and make your start every 5 days without fail. of Matt Cain’s 14 starts 8 haven’t reached 7 innings and he’s considered to be having a terrific year. 5 of Zach Greinke’s 15 starts didn’t reach 7 innings, last night leading the major in punchouts Justin Verlander only saw 5 of his 14 starts go past 7 innings and he’s were talking about Cy Young candidates.

Of Jamie Moyer’s 14 starts only 4 has he not gone 6 inning. Of those starts in games he hasn’t won, the offense hasn’t put up more than 3 runs including a game he only gave up 3 runs and got a no-decision. of his 6 losses, 4 he received no more than 2 runs of support and 1 with 3. The ERA’s not pretty because of 3 poor starts and the low inning total but he’s doing his job MUCH better than he’s being given credit for.

It’s not lowering the bar to expect a quality start, expectations are just ridiculous sometimes. If you had a staff where every pitcher was likely to go 7 innings you’d probably be fielding an all-star team.

Cow bells beat and echo
Drumming a faint World Series past

Strong dings from a hometown winning track
Hushed so quickly with an early attack

At last some winning air to breath
As warm breeze bring bats alive

Scattering hits across green fields
Lifting the spirits of northern skies

@ NJ I’m more beefing with the idea that a 4.50 ERA is considered “quality.” But at this stage I’d be pretty content if Moyer put out 6IP, 3ER regularly.

6 innings per start isn’t bad. Over 33 starts, it’ll give you about 200 innings. But the problem is because Moyer rarely goes more than 6 anymore, we can never make up for the times he gets bombed after 2 or 3 innings, which puts our bullpen that much more in the hole.

I’d be fine with all that if he was our #5, but unfortunately with all the injuries he’s more like our #3 – thus, expectations rise.

Whenever Moyer pitches (and he was very good last night) I ask myself if they playoffs started tomorrow, would you trust him as one of our 4 starters? I say NO, not against a good team in the post-season. But as the current staff is made up, it would be Cole, Blanton, Happ and Moyer in that order.

I belive Moyer is serviceable as a #5 for the rest of the regular season … but there is no way he should take the hill in the playoffs. A move MUST be made and sooner rather than later. Also thinking last night that I would not be surprised if Myers returns down the stretch for some reinforcements. I would like to see him in middle relief coming off the injury … but if we don’t make a move they could be forced to throw him back into the rotation.

^remember people have been saying no to Moyer against ‘good teams’ since he arrived in Philly after obscurity in Seattle, what reason is there to think he’s not going to be every bit as good as he’s been to this point?

I think the difference with Schilling was he still had some good heat on his fastball even in ’07, so had a little more room for mistakes.

I think the difference with Moyer now and then, is teams have shown that if you have patience (and a little help from the umpires) you can knock Moyer around. But maybe it’s just that the NL has finally adjusted to Moyer and it’s his turn to make counter-adjustments.

Geoff thats bull! If a prospect was really capable of doing a better job then why would the Phillies not do that? A little more run support and Moyer could be 9-1, not saying it would have shaken out that way but he’s pitching a hell of a lot better than a guy who should be on the scrap-heap. If teams are clammering for Brad Penny then why aren’t we at least quietly satisfied with Jamie Moyer?

It’s just anger and blindness blocking the truth, why is our most consistent starter this year our worst? Because he nears 100 pitches through 6 innings? Because he throws his fastball at the velocity of a change-up? Because he’s older than Ruben (bet you didn’t know that one), or because he’s lost 6 games in which 5 he didn’t get average run support? Grow up and get past your ego!

Because they signed him to a big contract and theyre stuck with him, thats why. Hes the worst because anytime the umpure calls a real strike zone and the hitters lay off the slop, he gives up liek 7 runs by the 4th inning and taxes the bullpen. This guy is THE PRIMARY REASON why our bullpen is all tired and injured. This guy is a walking tax on the bullpen. It wouldnt be so bad if Brett Myers wasnt out of the year, but now your relying on this guy to be a 2 or a 3 when he wouldnt even be in the starting rotation on most major league staffs.

You can compare because Schilling went out there with it very much acknowledged he had a plan in-spite of his stuff not being what it was. Schilling didn’t blow guys away in ’07 because he had some velocity left, he had the better of hitters because he used his experience to make what he had left count a la Jamie Moyer, pitch smart and let the hitters make the mistakes. Jamie Moyer has been mastering pitching with ‘substandard’ stuff for a very long time now, he’s not great, maybe he isn’t good but he’s above average because a quality start isn’t the average otherwise every pitcher would have a lock on that 4.50 ERA.

Geoff that is absolute bull again, through the Phillies pitching slump there was a number thrown out I believe it was last week that the Phils starters were forcing the pen to throw between 4 and 5 innings on average… How is that Moyer’s fault when he’s been going 6? He leads the team in innings pitched!? Moyer’s not going to save your bullpen having to work but he’s not been unexpectedly forcing into the game like the rest of the staff has.

Man you really need to do some studying before sticking to some of your viewpoints

“Schilling was always a power pitcher, but at the end of his career he became much more of a power/groundball pitcher”… hmmm that is by definition an opposite. Power pitchers get ground balls by overmatching hitters, groundball pitchers get groundballs instead of overpowering hitters.

Schillings last days were as a power pitcher but he acknowledged he had to be smart because his stuff wasn’t good enough to overpower outright like he could earlier in his career. He used the very strategy Moyer’s hallmarked and he was a hero in that town, guess it says a lot about so many Philly fans if they can’t get behind what the Boston fans could.

Why do you insist on comparing him to Schilling? Theyre not the same pitcher, not even at the end of their careers. Moyers win totals are high but his postseason stats are lame by comparison.

Schiling was MR. Clutch in the postseason his entire career. I really dont see any room for comparison. They really dont belong in the same sentence.

Geoff most pitchers in this league aren’t ‘mediocre’ and are trying to make a career enough to be mediocre. Tim Wakefield’s been the same pitcher for years and he has two rings and is far more susceptible to getting beaten up than Moyer and he’s having as good a year as anyone (in context).

It hurts not having Myers sure, but when your feeling down on the Phillies rotation look at the depth charts around the league and the amount of ‘names’ who have struggled this year. Would you rather the ’09 Wang than the ’09 Moyer. I would kill for us to have Jon Lester and he came into Philly with an ERA north of 5 last week.

We could have A LOT worse than Jamie Moyer.

Geoff because I said right up top that Moyer reminds me of what Schilling did in his final year by making the kind of adjustments Moyer makes just with lesser stuff. Your the one who’s getting on your high horse about Schilling and his stuff when I was talking about adjustments and pitching strategy.

BTW guys we’ve just had the revelation that Geoff’s real name is Jim Bronner. Apparently “a grand total of ZERO teams wanted him. ZERO.” which is something only his agent and real baseball insiders would know.

Moyer is part of that problem. Thats why everyone wants good pitching prospects because they need that new blood. Moyer is considered good but is really nothing more than average. In past eras that were dominated by pitching he wouldnt make any major league teams roster, which is why it took him so long to nail down a rotation spot in the major leagues – which is admirable. but theres no pitching now in comparison, so someone who is somewhere between average and a tinge above or below overall (Moyer) is considered good by comparison. Moyer is what he is, and the absolute lack of pitching depth in Major League Baseball now is what makes people think hes good.