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Baseball Winter Meetings Updates

Posted by Pat Gallen, Thu, December 10, 2009 02:20 PM | Comments: 402
Acquisitions, Analysis, News, Opinion, Posts

Originally posted at 1:09 p.m., December 7, 2009

Phillies Nation will continually update this post throughout the week as the MLB Winter Meetings heat up in Indianapolis.

Day 4:

(6:03 am): The Phillies are now back into the Halladay discussion, according to Ken Rosenthal. He says the Phillies are prepared to ship J.A. Happ, Dom Brown or Michael Taylor, and another prospect to Toronto in a deal.  They would also have to trade Joe Blanton to free up money for this to happen.  My thought: is this 100% worth it? The bounty is not as high as last season, however, giving up Blanton means two very good starters would be out, plus some prospects.  Interesting scenarios are brewing out in Indy early today.

Also, late last night, the Houston Astros swooped in and landed Brandon Lyon for a reported three years, $15 million. That’s a bit more than I figured he was worth, especially for a guy who has an up and down track record.  I though the Phils might be able to get him at two years under $10 million.

(11:30am): Jason Stark mentions the Phils are seriously considering John Smoltz as a “back-of-the-bullpen weapon.”  Smoltz’s agent apparently told the Phils that the pitcher has no problem with Citizens Bank Park; although we all know that has not always been the case.  Smoltz has bashed the Phillies home field  on numerous occasions.

(2:18pm) With the 17th overall pick, the Phillies selected Kenneth David Herndon from the Angels’ AA team. Herndon is a 24 year-old right-handed pitcher who was 5-6 with a 3.03 ERA and 11 saves in 50 appearances last season.

They also picked up Angelo Sanchez, another right handed pitcher. The 20 year-old went 5-1 with a 5.52 ERA in 12 starts with the Twins’ AAA affiliate.

On the flip side, the Phillies lost right-hander Carlos Monasterios to the New York Mets. You may remember him as one of the guys in the Bobby Abreu trade of 2006.

Day 3:

(9:38 pm): This Phillies.com headline says it all: Phillies not likely to land Halladay.  The Los Angeles Angels made an offer to the Blue Jays, and now it appears the Phillies are out of the mix.

(9:10 pm): Jayson Stark says that the Phillies have been equally aggressive on Fernando Rodney as they have been on Brandon Lyon.  Stark questions if the Phillies would pay Rodney “closer-type money.”

(8:04 pm): Roy Halladay update: Jon Heyman of SI joins the fray saying he’s heard that the Phillies are joining the Halladay discussions.  Who in your opinion has the best shot out of the Phils, Red Sox, Angels, or Yankees in the hunt for Doc?

(7:23 pm): Things have been relatively quiet regarding the Phillies over the past few hours.  However, if your scoring at home, cross Matt Lindstrom, LaTroy Hawkins, and possibly, Rich Harden, off your lists.  Lindstrom went to Houston in a trade, Hawkins signed with Milwaukee, and Harden might be on his way to the Rangers.  I’m a big fan of Harden and what he can bring, although he might be a reliever very soon because he just cant stay healthy.  I also brought up Lindstrom here on this forum a few days ago as a possible back-end guy, but Ed Wade struck while the iron was hot.

(3:53 pm): Earlier today, Todd Zolecki wrote a post saying the Phillies have just as good a chance as any other team at acquiring the services of Roy Halladay.  He polled executives around the league asking if they thought the Phillies had enough depth down on the farm to make something happen, and many said they did.  Still, does it make sense to get Halladay for what will likely be one year?  I see the Angels and Red Sox as front runners here, and the Yankees in the mix too if they are willing to give up either Phil Hughes or Joba Chamberlain.  It pains me to say that, because I hate that they get all the “good” players out there, but such is the case.  Would anyone hate to see Happ/Brown/Gose go for possibly one season of Doc?

(2:37 pm): John Smoltz and Ron Mahay are two names that have popped back up within the past few hours.  Smoltz would fight for the fifth spot in the rotation, and/or a late-inning bullpen situation.  Personally, I believe Smoltz is better suited as a bullpen arm. He’d fit well in the Myers/Park role. He pitched well at times last year, but seemed to be a three inning guy.  In 2009, from the fourth inning on, Smoltz recorded an ERA of 5.40.  He never once reached the seventh inning in any game last season.

Mahay is a great option should Scott Eyre walk away for good.  Mahay is 37 (why does it seem like every lefty is at least 35?) and posted an ERA just north of four a season ago with Kansas City and Minnesota.  He would ably fill the gap left by Eyre and can be the #1 lefty if JC Romero is not healthy enough for a return at the start of the season.

(2:25 pm): Sorry for the delay on the news, but we’ve finally resolved our server problems.  It was Phillies overload.

By now, you know that the Phillies inked Ross Gload to a two-year deal to round out their bench.  The terms of the contract have not yet been released, but the Phillies bench certanly will look a lot different than last season.  Gload hit .261/.329/.729 last season with Florida.  This is an OK move for RAJ to make.  Gload won’t knock your socks off, but can play several positions and led the NL in pinch hits in 2009.  I would rather the Phillies saved the money on Gload and went with a younger option, but following last seasons bench debacle, it’s understandable Amaro would solidify that shortcoming right away.  More soon…

Day 2:

(4:09 pm): Looks like that three-team trade between Arizona, Detroit, and the New York Yankees will be made.  The main pieces, Curtis Granderson and Edwin Jackson, will go to New York and Arizona, respectively.  The Tigers get a bunch of youngsters in return, including pitcher Max Scherzer.

You may not want to hear this, but now that a few of the Yankees blue chippers are packing, does that take them out of the Roy Halladay sweepstakes completely?  Does that also bolster the Phillies chances of getting Doc?  One of the Yankees top prospects, Austin Jackson, goes to Detroit, so they lose that piece which would certainly be involved for Halladay.  This is all just a forethought, obviously, but it’s something to think about. Although nothing really stops the Yankees from making trades.

(12:59 pm):All the talk over the last 24 hours here in Phillie-land has been about Joe Blanton.  Is it wise to move him?  How much will he make next season?  Why would Brad Penny get so much in free agency? (I threw the last one in myself).  David Murphy has put his own spin on it, and in his heart of hearts does not believe Big Joe goes.  That doesn’t mean it won’t happen, however, I think it’s something the Phillies certainly need to explore.

(10:38 am): My own two cents again, but after seeing what some pitchers are reeling in on the open market money-wise, I’d almost rather go with Bastardo, Escalona, and Condrey in the pen, with Kendrick, Moyer, and Free-Agent-to-be-Named in the running for the fifth rotation spot.  That would leave one relief spot open for a guy like Lyon, who looks to be commanding at least $5 million at this point (just a guess).  Rafael Soriano getting nearly $8 million through arb?  Maybe I’m nieve, but none of the guys out there seem worth that kind of dough?  Didn’t think Wagner was worth it, or Penny either.  Guess that’s just the way the market is opening up in the early going.

(9:02 am): According to Jon Paul Morosi, several teams are in on J.J. Putz.  He lists the Cubs, White Sox, D’Backs, Rangers, Nationals, and Tigers as all having interest, but don’t be surprised if Rube is kicking the tires on the former Met.  The 32-year old made $6 million last season, but was hindered by injuries, posting a 5.22 ERA in just 29 appearances.  Prior to his ’09 failure, Putz was a revelation in Seattle, putting up 36 and 40 saves in 2006 and 2007, respectively. He’d fit in nicely with Lidge and Madson toward the back of the ‘pen, but at what cost?

(8:39 am): Paul Hagen of the Philadelphia Daily News brings back our old friend Brett Myers as a possible free agent starting pitcher.  Hagen wonders why the Phillies haven’t looked his way at all this offseason.  I’d be all for it if Myers wanted to take a one-year, incentive laden deal, however, reports have him seeking a two-year deal, and he wants a shot at closing if he’s in the bullpen.  I’m not sure you can count on him as a starter, and I’m pretty certain his shtick grew tired here, so it’s doubtful we will see Myers again in ’10.

Cross some relievers off your big board if your scoring at home. Rafael Soriano and Rafael Betancourt each accepted arbitration with their respective clubs.  Soriano will be back with Atlanta, reportedly for somewhere in the $6.5-$8 million range.  Betancourt is looking for a raise from the $3.55 million he made with Colorado in 2009. Other relief pitchers who reject arbitration: Jose Valverde, Fernando Rodney, and Brian Shouse.

Day 1:

(7:30 pm): Take Brad Penny off your list of possible Phillies starters for next year.  He has signed a one-year (get ready for this), $7.5 million contract, plus $1.5 million in incentives, to join the St. Louis Cardinals.

Wow. That seems like a hefty amount for a guy who was released mid-season by the Boston Red Sox.  He finished with a 4.88 ERA between Boston and San Francisco, winning 11 games in 173 1/3 innings.  Hopefully, like with the Billy Wagner deal, this doesn’t hinder the Phillies attempts to acquire a starter through free agency.

(6:10 pm):Justin Duchscherer is now a free agent after declining arbitration from the Oakland A’s, according to ESPN’s Jerry Crasnick.  Duchscherer missed all of 2009, but is a former two-time all star – once as a starter, once as a reliever.  He is at the head of the buy-low class, and reports are out there that he may go to an east coast team; the reason being his divorced wife and son live in New Jersey. Assuming he is healthy and has gotten past his personal issues, Duchscherer would look great with a Phillies “P” on his cap.

(4:45 PM): Martino tweets about the Phillies bringing back both Chad Durbin and Clay Condrey, although nothing is set just yet.  Condrey seems like a no-brainer to me, but Durbin is a different story.  He made $1.65 million last season, so that figure may rise north of $2 million.  Not sure he is worth that much.  Thoughts?

(3:00 PM): Earlier today, Andy Martino of the Inquirer posted that the Phillies are meeting with representatives from Chan Ho Park’s camp to figure out where both sides are regarding a contract.  Park as said previously he wants to start, but the Phils view him as a very good piece in the bullpen.  He made $2.5 million last year and almost assuredly will be in line for a raise.  Park was an integral part that kept a shaky bullpen in one piece throughout the 2009 season, however, $3 million or more might be too much for the Phils to think about.

(2:17 pm): This is just my own two cents, but looking at our bullpen situation, does Matt Lindstrom make sense here in Philly?  The Marlins are reportedly shopping him and he’s coming off a season in which injuries took their toll on him.  Lindstrom throws in the upper-90′s, but does struggle with some control issues.  However, he’s arb-eligible this year and next, so he would come cheap.  The question is, which prospects would it take to nab him from Florida?  Anyone for or against this idea?

(1:00 pm):The first bit of Phillies news coming out is from Ed Price of AOL Fanhouse regarding Joe Blanton. Price says the Phils are considering moving Blanton because of his arbitration price-tag.  Big Joe made $5.475 million last season, and is due a raise after a stellar 2009 campaign.

Blanton would be looking at somewhere in the $7 million ballpark through arbitration, so trading him would give the Phils new flexibility.  However, it would take away one of the most solid #3′s in the National League.




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About Pat Gallen

Pat Gallen has written 1684 articles on Phillies Nation.

Pat is Editor-in-Chief of Phillies Nation. He also covers the Phils for 97.5 FM in Philly.

 
 
  • Posts: 0 Manny

    What’s with all the Mayberry hate? The kid did a decent job last year… and he’s good defensively. He impressed in a couple of games…

    That said, I like signing Gload. The bench looks very promising right now. One more new bullpen arm and we’re set. I wanna see Escalona, Mathieson, and especially Bastardo in the pen.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Mayberry can only hit fastballs … which probably made him AWESOME in high school.. decent in college… and below-average in professional baseball

    i’m not knocking him, but if you get paid to play baseball, you should be really good at all aspects of the game

    which is why i like the Rollins’ and Jayson Werth’s .. guys who don’t excel at any one thing.. but they do everything pretty well

     
  • Posts: 0 Lucky

    Manny,
    I’m with you man, I think Mayberry was awesome too and came through nicely in a few games. I also think his defense isn’t too shabby either. However if the Jays inquire on him in a package deal…You can’t be upset with that. We really haven’t seen much of Gload besides last season with the Marlins. Mayberry hasn’t even played a full season in the majors yet, so its hard to compare ”who’s better” at this point…If Mayberry sticks around, it wont be long before we find out for sure.

     
  • Posts: 0 Griffin

    I like Gload as a pinch hitter. I also liked Andy Tracy as a cheap alternative, but Gload is pretty good.

    No way the Phils give up Brown for a Halladay rental. It’s definitely not worth it.

     
  • Posts: 0 Dudley Monk

    I would go after Doc Halladay if we could sign him to a three-year deal. I would also give up Happ, Brown and Gose. Winning now is important and I am saying this because I am old, sick and dumb and want another ring before I croak. There is no time like the present. We should sign Lee, as well, to a three-year deal.

     
  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Looks like the Mariners or Rangers will land Harden for about 7.5 million. I don’t see any interest in Blanton. Anyone hearing anything? If Blanton can’t be traded forget about Halladay.

     
  • Posts: 0 Keith E

    @ (first reply)GWFightinsFan:
    I agree. Time to run with the big dogs!
    GO PHILS!!!

     
  • Posts: 0 Jesus

    Just read that the Phils are interested in Jason Marquis. Really?! WHY?!

     
  • Posts: 0 Pat Gallen

    Jesus: I think the Phillies are interested in anyone and everyone that can throw or field. It’s just the way it is. If its true, I’m not a Marquis fan, although he is a decent #5. However, I’m sure he’ll command a ridiculous amount just like everyone else.

    Ben Sheets for $12 million anyone???

     
  • Posts: 0 Brian of CO

    Going after Halladay isnt a bad idea, but I would say giving up Happ to get him would be insanity. Everyone wants to get rid of Happ before his full sophmore season because of Kyle Kendrick. It seems the majority of fans think because Kyle Kendrick pitches poorly in his 2nd season after a good rookie season that Happ will do the same. Happ has proven himeself, keep him, we have plenty of other “prospects” that the Jays would take without taking away from the current team, and probably wouldnt hurt the farm system all that much seeing the depth the Phillies have in the Farm system.

     
  • Posts: 0 Jesus

    I wouldn’t mind Marquis at 5mill but I would imagine he wants close to the 9.8mill he made last year. I really want the Phils to go after Kevin Correia. I would think he would cost under 3mill and is only 29. I know he pitched at Petco field but his home/away splits are pretty close.

     
  • Posts: 0 Manny

    Don: Thing with Mayberry is, I doubt that many on here saying he’s no good have even watched him play more than 20 games.

    All I can say, is that in the 3-5 games I saw him play, he did some pretty good and interesting things. It’s not like he’s condemned to just hitting fastballs for the rest of his pro life… he should be able to make some adjustments along the way.

     
  • Posts: 0 Griffin

    There is absolutely, positively, NO way Cliff Lee or Halladay signs a 3 year deal. No shot. Those guys are aiming for 7 year deals but may have to settle for 6 years.

    No one is trading for Ross Gload. If anyone else wanted Gload, they would have signed him yesterday. He is the Phillies left-handed pinch hitter.

    No one is trading a top prospect for a Halladay rental. Giving up 7 years of Dom Brown is not worth 7 months of Roy Halladay. Imagine if the Phillies traded Ryan Howard for a Mark Mulder rental a few years back. How would that have looked now?

    Dom Brown is a stud and he will be a stud in a Phillies uniform. If the Phillies weren’t willing to trade him for a year and a half of Halladay, why would they trade him for a year of Halladay?

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    I think the Phils should place Drabek and Brown off-limits, but make everyone else in the farm system, along with Blanton, available for a trade. I really think that as time goes on, the Jays will get more and more desperate to unload Halladay, and something along the lines of Blanton, Taylor and Gose might get it done. Then, i’d agree, its probably only feasible to sign either Lee or Halladay to an extension, and let the other one walk, and take the draft picks as compensation to replace the young talent you gave up in order to get them.

     
  • Posts: 1435 Pat Gallen

    Avatar of Pat Gallen
     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    Wow, that’s an awful lot to give up. Angels would be foolish to do that, and it would make the Jays come out smelling like roses if they could pull it off

     
  • Posts: 0 Griffin

    I agree, that’s a lot for the Angels to give up. Jays should pounce on that offer.

     
  • Posts: 0 shag beta sigma delta

    I like how every body knows what these guys will ask for NEXT year, who knows, maybe they have an off year, I am not saying they will but both Doc, and Lee may surprise us all at the end of next year. And unless they want to go play in NY no team is going to give a pitcher 6 or 7 years, I do not see it happening unless it is the Yankees, and even in NY there is a limit.
    Maybe someone else will, but it is crazy to give a 31 32 or 33 year old pitcher 7 year deal. If Lee has a good year I do not know why you would not offer him 5 years 100 million, or Halladay 4 or 5 years for 85-100 million, if you think they will be dominant for that long.
    But I do not see giving up the farm for 1 year, if you can get Doc to agree to 3 4 or 5 years before the trade then you can give up a few more prospects.

     
  • Posts: 0 SpankyYankee

    WORLD SERIES CLOTHING :

    W/S HATS WITH NY LABEL IN THE CROWN …..$24.99….FROM FHILHY $50
    W/S SWEATSHIRTS NY LABEL IN THE CROWN..$54.99…FROM FHILHY $75

    ON THE LOSERS SIDE – CLOTHING PRICES BELOW SUBJECT TO CHANGE!

    FHILHY PANITES WITH A CRAP STAIN IN THEM……. PRICELESS :}

     
  • Posts: 0 WFC010

    Well, I never really expected us to land the Doc anyway…I just really didn’t want the Yankees to have him. As long as he goes to the Angels or even the BoSox, I won’t feel as bad about it.

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Oh well….at least the Cubs or Dodgers didnt get him

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    They could at least land Marquis to add rotation depth, and Lyon to bolster the bullpen/

     
  • Posts: 0 joedad

    The Jays would need to be stoned not to accept that immediately although I have a tough time believing the Angels would give up that much for someone they can sign for a draft pick in one year.

     
  • Posts: 0 Burt

    All they have to do is upgrade the back end of the bullpen. With an average closer last year they would have won at least 100 games and run away with the N.L. East. Halladay would have cost too much in both prospects and salary

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    THey need to accept that deal…

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Id be ok with keeping Blanton and adding Marquis and Lyon, and trying to internally fill the rest of the bullpen. Maybe resign Park.

     
  • Posts: 0 WFC010

    The Angels must really be hard up for Halladay, if they are willing to give up so much for him. But even with them having Doc, they still would need at least one other top notch pitcher if they hope to beat the Yankees. Now, if they can resign Lackey as well…

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    damn it, the astros got Lyon. I thought hed be a great fit here. I want NO part of Rodney…just resign Park. try to grab another reliever. damn it.

     
  • Posts: 0 Lucky

    I’ll tell you this….If the Jays will take any prospects besides Taylor and Drabek, Than Amaro needs to pull this trigger!! And pull it now!!

    You hear that Amaro?? Pull that shit!

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    Lucky, I agree except for I think it should be Brown that’s off limits instead of Taylor

     
  • Posts: 0 Lucky

    Yea, thats what I meant to say GW. Brain freeze I guess? The Angels aint playing games right now, they want Doc bad!! Like I said if Amaro can leave Drabek and Brown out the deal than he BETTER push them papers across the desk. We’ll worry about 2011 later, and who we gave up later to require him. One thing is for sure…You cant miss who you never seen (meaning who we give up), right? Plus we would get picks if Halladay would sign elsewhere after 2011. This should be a no brainer here! Amaro would regret this shit later if it ends up Phils VS Angels in the WS next season…OR Yankees, OR Boston for that matter.

     
  • Posts: 0 Matt

    I’m still skeptical it’s going to happen, but I have no major problem with sending Happ and Taylor in the deal. I’m with Lucky, if we can do it and be smart about it, then go for it. Drabek is obviously off limits, and Domonic Brown should be, too. I don’t wanna deal Taylor but if it means a much better shot at 3 straight pennants and 2 World Series titles in 3 years, I can’t complain. The NL East will be VERY competitive this season, but if we get Doc, we’ll put ourselves even further ahead of the rest of the pack.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Please let me know when someone other than Ken Rosenthal reports this. He can’t report accurately on the last time he took a dump. The Phillies would never trade Happ in that deal ever, especially if you believe Blanton must go to free up payroll. Thats not to say I don’t think they shouldn’t.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 WFC010

    An Angels team with both Lackey and Halladay would be rather scary for the Phillies, unless the Phils can manage to land another top notch starter, and knowing RAJ, he could probably find somebody decent guy whom none of us have even thought of.

     
  • Posts: 0 bfo_33

    From what I’ve read, Halladay is looking for 3 more years, unlike Lee, who is looking for a Santana/CC type deal. Stark states Phils are his first choice (lives near Clearwater, a winning team), and I would hope if we are giving anything up, would require a 24 hr negotiating window for an extension.
    Lee/Halladay/Hamels + a combination of Moyer, Kendrick, Pedro, and any other scrub with a possible July call up of Drabek is a pretty damn good rotation for the regular season, and an incredible post season staff. Roy and Lee also give the bullpen 2 days off – they are going 8 each time. We could make do with Madsen, Lidge,…..
    IF….. you can get Halladay to sign an extension, pull the trigger as long as it doesn’t include Drabek. No extension, no deal.
    To the spelling Nazis – it’s the comment section of a sports blog, not 4th grade with Sister Helen. Lighten up. With the exception of Roy vs Matt, it doesn’t cause confusion.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Is this actually a serious thing with Halladay? I just woke up.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 Ed R.

    hahaha Dipsy that was kinda classic…I just woke up.

    I do think it is very real and I do think Blanton being on the market is a big sign of that. I know he is not going to be a cheap third starter but he is a very reliable third starter. Why else would you trade him other than because you need the cash for a bigger fish?

    Don’t forget the Jays did give teams the ability to negotiate an extension with Halladay before a trade happens. Amaro may have come to the realization that many of us did a while ago and that Halladay would be easier to extend than Lee.

    However here is my question though, or rather my reservation. You add Halladay which is great but at the cost of losing a very good 3rd starter and a cheap 3/4 starter in Happ. So now going into the season you might have a sick 1-2-3 but the back end of your rotation is what? Kendrick and Moyer? They have pretty much said Drabek will not appear in the majors until the end of next season, possibly as a call up or if their rotation is destroyed with injuries. I think I’d rather stick with Happ and Blanton. Especially since Blanton will be gone after next year anyway and Happ will still be cheap for a few more years. But if Amaro can get Halladay for Happ, Brown, someone else and you get rid of Blanton is that too much?

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    I agree Ed. And don’t forget that we have ARB coming up with Shane and others. IF you are going to sign Halladay for the “big run”, you should probably trade Drabek, Blanton, and keep Happ. At this point, I regard Happ as more valuable than Drabek. He’s proved it.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 sportsphan

    I do NOT want to give up Blanton and Happ for Halladay. What if Cole Hamels doesn’t “come back” this season? Then you have a rotation of Lee and Halladay, basically. I DO agree with the first poster on these replies, though. It’s time for the Phillies to start acting and paying like a World Champion team instead of a poor relation. If we lose Lee after this season, or lose Ryan Howard at any point in the near future, it’s a crime. Everyone knows that they have the money. They’ll never be the Yankees, but the more they win, the more they’ll make. My understanding is that, even with the minor increase in ticket prices, they have almost sold out every game already for the 2010 season.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ed R.

    I agree Dipsy. I am always cautious of trading away proven talent over the unproven guy waiting in the wings. The article that Rosenthal wrote very clearly stated that just getting rid of Blanton would only clear about half ot he salary that Halladay will cost the team next year. Blanton will make approx 7 mil and Halladay makes 15.75, so another deal or two might have to be made. Now ask yourself, anyone, who on the Phillies would command enough salary to allow the Phillies to get Halladay without going over a budget? My best guess, one of your starting OF’s. Ibanez or Werth. Knowing all of that, is Halladay really worth all of that?

     
  • Posts: 0 Griffin

    There is no way that Happ is more valuable than Drabek. That’s like saying in 2004 that Placido Polanco is more valuable than Chase Utley, since he’s proven it.

    Drabek has a celing of a #2 starter whereas Happ is more of a #5 who got incredibly fortunate last year.

    I wouldn’t trade Taylor, Brown or Drabek for Halladay.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ed R.

    Oh Griffin, hindsight is a wonderful thing is it not? In 2004 at the time Polanco was more valuable than Utley. The organization believed Utley was going to be a better player but to say they knew for sure is impossible. You never know for sure. Now in 2009 it is a no brainer, Utley is better than Polanco. Period. But you can’t tell me that you know for sure that Drabek will be better than Happ. It is a possibility, maybe a better than not possibility but you don’t know that. Look at Gavin Floyd or even Brett Myers, both were thought to be future aces and neither lived up even close to that.

    I think the phrase the devil you know over the devil you don’t. Use what you know over what you don’t.

    I don’t disagree that Happ over performed last year, no question. But at this point, you know what Happ will give you, you don’t know what Drabek is or can become.

     
  • Posts: 0 Griffin

    Ed R., I agree that we don’t know for sure what Drabek will do. I would argue that we don’t know for sure what Happ will do in the future as well. But I would take the future of Drabek (with the possibility that he may not amount to anything) over the future of Happ, who has a much lower ceiling.

    Also, Chase Utley was a first round pick and there was little doubt he would be a very good player. He turned into a great player which is something that a merely good Polanco in his prime had no chance of becoming.

     
  • Posts: 0 schwalmy

    Blanton gets traded elsewhere maybe we get a closer type or our setup bullpen help for him…. mlbtraderumors has the possibility of hamels for doc even up!!!!!Although I doubt it … I wouldn’t mind the trade of an outfielder we have studs in the minors that need to come up remember what happened to howard …. all in all these are great problems to have 5 years ago could you have believed we would be talking about the possibility of a rotation with 3 #1s in it i mean ninties braves with high ninties fastballs and we are talking to smoltz to gotta love it…. its hard to type!!!!! i’m excited

     
  • Posts: 0 Matt

    Woah woah woah, we’re calling Happ “proven talent” based on one year? If that’s the case, then wasn’t Kyle Kendrick “proven talent” after his rookie year too? Look at all the numbers, Happ was very lucky last year and isn’t as good as he looked, much like Hamels isn’t as bad as his stats showed last year. Things have a way of evening out.

    And NO NO NO on trading Drabek and keeping Happ. No offense, but I’m certainly glad you’re not the GM.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ed R.

    I never said I would trade Drabek over Happ, I just said I am cautious when it comes to trading away proven talent, as in, I know what Happ is going to give me. 10-15 wins a year, 4.00 era. Over a guy who I have no idea what he can do. He could be an ace, he could be a flop. That is what every GM has to weight, what you know vs what you don’t.

     
  • Posts: 0 Griffin

    The chances of Happ’s ERA being around 4 or lower next year are not very high.

     
  • Posts: 0 Matt

    I don’t know why you’re banking on 10-15 wins and a 4.00 era from Happ. One season is a small sample size. I agree with Griffin.

    Anyway, I’m off to take a test…hopefully when I come back home, I get to see the news that the Phillies acquired Doc for Jamie Moyer and 3 dozen soft pretzels…

     
  • Posts: 0 Kyle

    Amaro just said of acquiring Halladay “I don’t think there’s any likeliness. None.”

    Do we believe this?

     
  • Posts: 0 Manny

    Happ has pitched for TWO years now… and he’s been very good BOTH years.

     
 
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