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The Dip: Business is Business

Posted by The Dipsy, Tue, December 22, 2009 09:11 AM | Comments: 134
Posts, The Dip

The Dip is back. Welcome to another edition penned by our own commenter, The Dipsy. Agree or disagree with what he says? Tell us by leaving your comments.

After a six month dance comprised of equal parts fixation, stubbornness, and incompetence, Ruben Amaro finally delivered Phillies fans Roy Halladay, gift wrapped with a bow on top, just in time for Christmas. While the front office finally seemed sated, the attendant loss of Cliff Lee – in an altogether separate trade – has left many fans with a bitter taste in their mouths because most of us believe it didn’t have to happen. Fans can view the departure of Cliff Lee in a number of ways: stupid, short sighted, panic induced, and cheap spring to my mind. I view the deal as the squandering of a once in a lifetime opportunity to become one of the great teams of its era. While the fans have been told the reasons why it had to go down this way, we’re still not sure we really understand. But maybe not understanding is better, because if we knew the real reasons, we might be that much more angry.

It’s A Baseball Decision

Giving up prospects to get a really good player does serious damage to your farm system – I get it. If we were getting blue chip prospects back from Seattle I could ALMOST understand it. From all accounts they are decent prospects. To my way of thinking, you don’t trade an underpaid Cy Young winner when you’re in the middle of a string of World Series runs just so you can add players to your farm system. If the Phillies had kept Lee, the minor league talent still would have been middle of the road. But we don’t need any players from there right now, anyway.

Worried about replenishing the pipeline? If I’m not mistaken we get compensatory picks for Lee and Blanton when they leave after next season. If the plan was always to make that second trade for prospects, it would have made a helluva lot more sense to make the Halladay trade then hang on to Lee and trade him during spring training when you can get more value. Perhaps we could have even traded Blanton instead. As a baseball decision, this was a poor one. But it was more than that.

It’s a Business Decision

David Montgomery, Wharton graduate, made a statement last week that the Phillies were “already in the red”. If you’re like me, you found these remarks to be disingenuous and insulting. There are a zillion ways in accounting to measure valuation and profits and I’m sure Dave had his pick of which one he wanted to use to back up his assertion. Just for fun though, lets assume that he’s being truthful. Operating from this premise I offer the following remarks.

Baseball teams are capital assets. The money that is made goes back into the team. That is why the Skull and Bones Society that is Phiilies ownership has turned a 30 million investment into about $500 million. This is called “capital appreciation”. Montgomery thinks we have no concept of this. I have my own business and on any given day you can ask me how my revenue stream is and I can say “it sucks”. Never mind that I’ve socked away a ton into my business over the years. Yet, because of the nature of businesses and how they are set up, I can still look a guy in the eye and tell him that, at the moment, “I’m in the red”. This is what the Phillies do.

Let’s assume that the Phillies really ARE struggling financially. Given the amount of gold bullion they rake in every year on attendance, TV, concessions, advertising, merchandising, blah blah, if they can’t turn a profit, I would suggest that they are working with a flawed business model and that they need to change it. I don’t know any business (and we are talking “business” here) that would allow the guys that run it to lose them money every year…well, except the Pirates owner. As a consumer, I implore the ownership to make the appropriate personnel changes to make the club profitable so I don’t have to see another Cliff Lee fiasco in my lifetime.

At the risk of venturing into esoterica, I would call the reader’s attention to a thing in business called “branding”. It is the concept that a business utilizes, through capital expenditure, marketing, commitment to excellence in the product space, and overall product quality, to gain an additional revenue stream that can be attributed directly to its reputation – it’s what all right-thinking businesses aspire to. This revenue stream can inure to the business during poor business cycles when other competing products are more effected. Think: McDonald’s, Clorox, Gillette, iPod. In sports, think of the Cowboys, Yankees, Dodgers, Lakers, Jeff Gordon, etc. Why do you think the Cowboys have so many fans in states not named Texas and why these same fans stuck with them after the glory days of the 70′s, and when they stunk in the 80′s. Because they did everything they could to win, had great players, and did it for a long time.

If the Phillies had kept Cliff Lee and won another Series, there would be kids growing up in Nebraska as Phillies fans. Buying Phillies stuff. Flying in for Phillies games twice a year. There’s a tangible dollar value in that. Montgomery knows it yet looks elsewhere because he and his partners won’t be around in 10 years to reap that money.

When the Phillies kissed off the chance to keep Cliff Lee for another year, they sent a message to everyone that while they’d love to be in the World Series, it would have to be on their terms. That approach inspires no one. While trading Lee saves the Phillies a few bucks in the short term, they missed the opportunity to become a money-making machine in the long run that another World Series title would bring them. The chances of that happening without Lee are considerably less. And THAT’S why trading Lee is a bad business decision, too.

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About The Dipsy

The Dipsy has written 29 articles on Phillies Nation.

 
 
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Can we please stop crying of Cliff Lee after January 1, 2010 …

    I was pretty sure that it would only last a few days, after people realized that it was a move they had to make to keep them within their budget

    but it seems like people don’t understand, and just like to complain..

    so we have 9 days left to bitch about Cliff Lee.. and then we should maybe start being really, really, really glad that the best pitcher in baseball plays for the Phillies!

     
  • Posts: 0 Catch 22 f/k/a H Man

    “catch, first of all vasquez is not even close to the pitcher that doc is. second, then where are we next year when vasquez and lee walk? finally, why would the braves trade him to us without paying a premium? so we give up a package of a few not great prospects (maybe d’arnaud or taylor and change), just take on $12.75 million for an inferior pitcher even though we don’t have budget for that, and then he walks next year in FA. thats a good idea?”

    Of your points, the best is that the Braves might not have been willing to make the trade, perhaps that’s true. As for the rest, I am not saying that Vazquez is better than Halladay – of course Vazquez is better than Halladay. But if we don’t have Halladay, we have Lee (and, I think he would sign long-term) so, if you make this trade for (D’Arnaud or Taylor), you have Lee and Vazquez versus just Halladay. I’ll take the former any day of the week.

    What I’m saying is, first, that Lee, Hamels and Vazquez would have been a more formidable 1-2-3 than Halladay, Hamels and Blanton and would have allowed the team to have either Blanton or Happ (and not Moyer or Kendrick) as the 5th starter – it’s an incredibly strong and deep rotation and, I think, better than the rotation we’ll throw out there this year when we’ll also have a depleted farm system from the Halladay trade.

    Second, if we don’t acquire Halladay, we sign Lee – I think that deal would have been done and Lee’s statements since the trade support that theory (yes, it’s easy for him to talk now, but it does appear he really wanted to stay).

    Third, if Drabek is coming up, I really don’t care if Vazquez walks in 2011. That’s the year I move Drabek into the rotation and I get draft picks as compensation for Vazquez (and perhaps also Blanton and Werth, if he leaves). So, doing a Vazquez trade would also allow you to build the farm system rather than deplete it.

     
  • Posts: 0 Catch 22 f/k/a H Man

    I meant to say ‘OF COURSE VAZQUEZ IS NOT BETTER THAN HALLADAY”

     
  • Posts: 0 SDO

    The day after the deal was official, I said almost exactly the same thing as this post did, except in much less detail of course.

     
  • Posts: 0 SDO

    Does anyone seriously think the Braves would trade Vazquez to the Phillies?

     
  • Posts: 0 Ben

    i didn’t realize mike dunn was that highly regarded. still, melky while league average was their 5 outfielder, then two good prospects. its probably better, but not significant (imo). also, i still say that the one aspect i definitely like about the lee deal is they dealt him to a team that we will only see in the world series, and its a team that has never been to the series (although they have a shot this year).

    again, you can’t look at the deal in a vacuum. the difference of vasquez for a year and lee for a year isn’t that huge, b/c they are both one year rentals. you’re not going to empty the tank for one year of any pitcher. also vasquez went to the yankees, a team that can afford to overpay b/c they have the pockets and lineup to do so.

    at the end of the day, and i’ve been saying this all along, is if we just look at the lee deal we can probably say “we should have gotten a little more in return”. but if i’m amaro, and the halladay deal is being held up for an upgrade from the 5th prospect to the 4th in the mariners system its not worth holding it up.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Well Catch, we were never gonna sign Lee. He wants 5 years. It never would have happened. Thats the biggest reason we traded for Hallladay. Lee can talk all he wants about how he would have signed but if he wanted to so badly he had about 72 hours to do so from the time the Phils started the Halladay trade up. Vazquez was not coming here because the Braves wouldn’t let him in a million years. And I’ll take Halladay, Hamels, and Blanton.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    I have said enough already about this situation…..and….unfortunately, there are just not too many of you who are listening…all (most)of you guys want to do is bitch and complain about it….as if the Phillies are WORSE off instead of actually BETTER after these trades..

    Don M is right….PLEASE…as of Jan 1 can we PLEASE turn the corner….and talk about the upcoming season…and be excited about it…BECAUSE WE SHOULD BE!!!!

     
  • Posts: 0 Ben

    catch, we still would have had to somehow pay a premium for him, and take on his salary. i agree i like lee, vasquez, hamels over halladay, hamels, blanton, but you’d have to convince the braves to do the deal and you’d have to somehow absorb the cost.

    finally, lee would not have signed for 3 years $20 mil, so we would maybe be able to lock up lee, but not at the “bargain” of halladay. will be interesting what he fetches though (and how many years).

     
  • Posts: 0 bfo_33

    Dipsy, name calling is the last resort of a weak argument. Read into the details of the anti-trust exemption.

    In the majors, the anti-trust exemption primarily involves control over the location of the franchise, as well as discretion of the league over buyers if the team is sold. Football, Hockey, and Basketball do not have it, which is why the Whalers, Super Sonics, Cardinals, Colts, Browns, could pack up and leave to the highest bidder, but the Expos got stuck in limbo until a “suitable” location was found. It’s also why Mark Cuban doesn’t own the Cubs, but owns the Mavs. All the factors which govern player-owner interactions (from arbitration to free agent eligibility) are from the CBA. Like other forms of entertainment, ticket prices, parking, and concessions are based on the market. Taxes,…., are based on city, state, and federal laws, just like Football, Hockey, and Basketball.

    The other impact involves minor league affiliations (which is not day to day unless you are a minor leaguer, then it controls you).

     
  • Posts: 0 Catch 22 f/k/a H Man

    I agree that Lee would not have accepted a 3 year deal almost at any price. But maybe he would have taken a 4-year deal with an option year (or even two option years) and that might have been something the Phils would have done. The thing that this trade also does, however, is that it nearly forces them to sign Jayson Werth to a humongous contract next year or risk having a much weaker line-up in 2011. Of all of the Phils players, due to the presence of Taylor, Werth was likely the easiest to replace. Now that replacement is gone and it’s going to create a problem because Brown is not ready this year and probably won’t be ready next year either.

     
  • Posts: 0 Adam

    I think bfo got it right– what would you rather have? The Diamondbacks who won in 2001 and have won 2 division titles since, or Reuben’s Phillies who look like they’re going to win 5 straight division titles plus who knows how many after that considering he KEEPS REPLENISHING THE SYSTEM? Good teams stay good through the farm system.

     
  • Posts: 0 Adam

    This is a stupid discussion, everyone knows Lee is coming back here as a free agent!

    \crosses fingers

     
  • Posts: 0 Jonathan

    amen. hit the nail on the head with this post.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    You don’t like being called a genius?

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    The is a different between profit for a corp and the investers/owners making money. they are making gobs and gobs of money desite not turning a profit. Is the balance sheet a matter of public record?

    I can’t comment on Lee being traded because my Figgins+Lee-Blanton-Victorino+two first round picks > Polanco+two supplemental picks was my last comment. Would’ve saved 3 million as well and gotten similar prospects.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    bfo- The anti trust exemption in baseball, among other things, gives something called “the reserve clause” which allowed teams to hold a players rights in perpetuity. The clause was challenged by Curt Flood back in the 60′s and eventually led MLB and the developing players union to agree to something called “free agency”. Free Agency was created as a compromise so that the the reserve clause did not have to come under further scrutiny from Supreme Court or Congress. If the anti trust exemption were repealed by Congress, the reserve clause would be eliminated, which would lead to the teams having no control whatsoever to negotiate with their own players. In short, it would be hell on earth. Always happy to help.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 NEPA

    Adam..Since we are raising the payroll next year and Cliff lee is coming back as a free agent.
    Why is everybody so mad at this deal?

     
  • Posts: 0 griffin

    Adam, how exactly is Amaro replenishing the farm system? He traded two top 25 prospects and one top 75 prospect for Halladay (which is defensible) and received zero top 100 prospects for Lee.

     
  • Posts: 0 Memphis

    I’m not convinced this team runs on a strict budget. If so, you don’t bid against yourself for Moyer, Ibanez, and Polanco (the former inexcusable, the latter 2 early in the FA process before the market is defined). You don’t go and sign $20M pitchers no matter how good they are. You certainly don’t — as a contender — trade away a guy like Lee, slated to make a ridiculously cheap $9M (and forgo 2 compensation draft picks should Lee sign elsewhere). None of that is consistent with being budget-conscious.

     
  • Posts: 0 mikemike

    George I love people like you, go to college and think they know everything. So the first thing they attack is grammar, if you can’t see this move of lee as a salary dump,then you are a idiot, the purpose of my anger is if the phillies would have spent less than a million dollars in previous drafts, joe saunders a starting pitcher for the angels would be here, joe nathan a reliver, and others i mention. they have shown they dont care by this lee trade. If they would have move lee for better prospect maybe i could live with it, but the trash they took is a disgrace.I really hope they lose 100 games a year from now on, in my 58 years of watching this games , this is the first time we had a chance for a dynasty for at least two or three more years, to be like the lakers and boston with all there basketball championships or pat, or yankees, dodgers a real chance for immortal greatness, and we are letting this owners off easy. so i am frustrated by there actions. And when ruben says he needs to restock the system he had his chance last draft and choose to let four top prospect walk. spent less than even the marlins in the draft, so sellout every game means nothing to these owners, loyalty means nothing to these weasels. nine million dollars ,think of it 5 owners putting up 1.64 million about to have the kind of team we deserve. and the 550 million dollars profit for owning the team means nothing either i guess. 30 million now worth all that money, so who would it hurt to keep lee one season and go for it again.

     
  • Posts: 0 griffin

    Memphis, well said. I agree completely and am shocked that so many people are giving Amaro a complete pass.

     
  • Posts: 0 beta sigma shag

    First most fans understand why Lee was traded, might not like it but, knew that Lee Haladay would not be here together. Unless you are the Marlins and play to win on world series every so often then dump all your talent because you do not want to pay them, You have to look at the big picture, the Phillies could not afford to give up what they gave up for Doc and field a decent team in two years.
    Second you can not just let Blanton walk they would still have to pay him this year, even if he signs somewhere, and what makes you think you would get anything for him, when every one knew they had to dump payroll.
    Third you are not very bright if you do not think RAJ did not shop Lee around to other teams, none of you know what other teams were offering, and like I said before can we at least see these guys play one game before we decide that they are junk.
    You can take all your minor league ratings and smoke them, they change every year every week some times every day. And some of the top rated prospects suck in the big time.
    And as usually Dipsy, you align yourself up with the vocal minority on how the team is run. Most of you were saying what a terrible deal Raul was last year then love him. Want to trade Happ saying he is not that good and he is one of the m ost consistant pitchers they had last year.
    So get off the pipe and realize this is a better team now then it was 3 months ago.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Beta – Huh? So, are you telling me that you completely understand and believe the “budget” that the ownership has given Ruben to work with is reflective of how much they can afford when taking into account their desire to make a reasonable profit and not be “in the red”?? C’mon dude. You’re better than that.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 bfo_33

    Dipsy, I’d agree…. if it was 1974 (from Wikipedia):
    Removing the reserve clause from player contracts became the primary goal of negotiations between the Major League Baseball Players Association and the owners. The reserve clause was struck down in 1975 when arbitrator Peter Seitz ruled that since pitchers Andy Messersmith and Dave McNally played for one season without a contract, they could become free agents. This decision essentially dismantled the reserve clause and opened the door to widespread free agency.

    Now terms are dictated from the Collective Bargaining Agreement. An interesting diversion from the Lee discussion.

    …Genius…

     
  • Posts: 0 BS

    mikemike, 100 loss seasons? because we didn’t keep cliff lee and instead got the best pitcher in the league to replace him? gtfo. That’s just ridiculous.

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    They do operate on a fairly strict budget, its not about bidding against themselves. They messed up on Moyer, no doubt about it. However, when they see someone they like at the price they like, they waste NO time and go hard after them.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chris.I

    I’m tired of hearing about Lee/Halladay situtaion too. But you can’t help but to understand how all the fans feel.

    Yes we traded Lee away for a bag of peanuts (without the bag). I’m mad, your mad, we’re all mad at this point.

    Yes Amaro should have explored all venues, and went with the best deal he could get…And YES I believe he could of WAY more out of it. Look what it took to pry Halladay from Toronto-Basically our whole entire farm system. In my oppinion Lees value is and should of been close enough to Halladays asking price.

    I’t would have been more wise in my oppinion to have given Lee the contract we gave to Halladay, because it would have left us with our farm still in place, and I love to believe Amaro tried to take that venue. If not than I would lose a lot of respect for the man. But for whatever reason, we DID give up the farm, and we did trade Lee for Peanuts, and we got ”quote” the best pitcher in baseball. Lets just leave it at that and talk about these results 2 years from now. Everyone needs to forget it and move on.

     
  • Posts: 0 rob

    This is all ridiculous. So far phillies get an F for the ofseason. With all the money the fans gave the organization this past year and all we get is a slight upgrade from Lee to Halladay, and from Feliz to Polanco all while giving up Taylor and Drabek. What a slap in the face. I’m done going to games.

     
  • Posts: 0 shag beta sigma delta

    Lee was not taking 3 years with two option years, if you do not think they put a similar deal on the table for Lee you are being ignorant. Maybe not the exact deal, but Doc is by far the more consistent pitcher over the last 3 years and is worth more money. Lee did not want to sign an extension, or maybe it was his agent. Again with we got a bag of peanuts, I would wager none of you has any idea or these guys are, they are young prospects, I have more faith in the scouting team the phillies have over anyone on here who thinks they know how to evaluate talent.
    Truly look at Lee’s numbers over the last four years compared to Doc’s it is no contest. What did Lee do in Cleveland last year, and what did Doc do pitching in arguably the hardest division in baseball, this is a no brainer

     
  • Posts: 0 shag beta sigma delta

    One other thing what makes you people think that RAJ did not seek other venues for both Blanton and Lee. Do you really believe he called the Mariners and said I’ll give you Lee what do you want to give me.
    I know this is going to sound like sour grapes, but maybe just maybe we are over valuing the guy for a three week stretch, not saying we are, he was clutch. But he did lose focus after his first 3 or 4 starts, and did lose focus in Cleveland. I think Doc is by far the better pitcher, and if Lee gets 25 million a year next year then we got a steal for 20 million with Doc.

     
  • Posts: 0 NickFromGermantown

    Here’s a scenario to think about. It’s essentially a short sale (sell high and buy back low later and profit). Hope the Mariners are out of playoff contention by the deadline so we can trade to get Lee back. This way they pay much of his salary and to get him back we only need to trade prospects worth half of a season’s value for Lee. We’d make out like bandits! Brilliant!

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    One more time. The reserve clause is still included in player contracts, but since there is collective bargaining which created arbitration and limited free agency, it doesn’t have nearly the force that it did prior to ’75. If the anti-trust exemption were removed, then so would the reserve clause. That would mean that once the CBA expired, any player who’s contract expires, minor leaguer, rookies, whoever, could negotiate with any other team. No more minor league control, no more arbitration.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 Catch 22 f/k/a H Man

    Rob – that’s how I felt when this went down too – I’m going to miss the idea of seeing Taylor and Drabek develop and I’m a little concerned that Ruben has begun to get into the old George Steinbrenner mode of trading all of his top prospects. If Halladay delivers and Aumont, Gillies and/or Ramirez live up to their potential, it might not be nearly as bad as everyone makes this out to be. But watching Michael Taylor hit .320 and make all-star games would be painful, to say the least.

     
  • Posts: 0 shag beta sigma delta

    I got a better scenario, Lee pitches for Seattle all year, and the Phillies already have a contract waiting for him to sign next off season.
    Then after they resign Wreth and Howard and JRoll and Shane and Hamels then we can all pay $150 a ticket to sit in section 417

     
  • Posts: 0 NickFromGermantown

    I understand everyone wants to make what they are worth, but when is it enough? I think the Phils’ top-paid players should have offered a small paycut to keep Lee here. When you are making millions upon millions and the owners are red-lining their budget to win another championship, I don’t think that is so unreasonable.

     
  • Posts: 0 NickFromGermantown

    By the way, I think this article is over the top in the negativity department. The poster makes assumptions that don’t account for an organization’s operating expenses.

     
  • Posts: 0 Catch 22 f/k/a H Man

    Baseball players don’t take haircuts and they don’t give refunds – it’s against their religion.

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    I think people are drinking too much of the ownership’s Kool Aid here. Yes it has been a great past few seasons, and thats mostly due to the great drafting of Mike Arbuckle (Utley, Rollins, Howard, Hamels) But remember drafting players and giving signing bonuses costs relatively little, and of course the owners are willing to shell that out because its necessary to field a competitive product. But it also does not necessarily show a commitment to winning on the part of the ownership. My belief is, and I think Dipsy hit it on the head, that the ownership is willing to spend what it has to in order to be competitive, and expand the value of the team. BUT, and I may catch some flack for saying this, we just happened to get lucky in ’08, and the chips fell so that we ended up as the best team at the end. It was not because the team owners did all the could to win. But now, when presented with a chance to field possibly one of the best rotations of all time, giving them an excellent shot at a 2nd parade in 3 years, they balked. This was not about replenishing the farm system and anyone looking at it with a clear head knows it. They got questionable talent, who has never played above Single A, which amounts to a lottery ticket. I’m guessing none of them will amount to a hill of beans for this team, and odds are I will be right.

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    Along with winning, they had a chance to really establish the Phillies as a brand-name team with a national fan base. People say that no one outside of Philly could like the Phils because they view the city as a second rate blue collar town. To that I say, look at the Pittsburgh Steelers! That town is an absolute toilet, yet the Steelers have a huuuge fan base from all over. That’s because the team has a reputation for excellence and a commitment to winning. The Phillies could have had a shot at that, but balked, over 9 million bucks. Now the Phillies could very well do great this season, and I hope they do. They definitely improved their team by getting Halladay, but they certainly did NOT improve their team by trading Lee, and thats the point everyone is trying to make.

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    Ohh and as far as operating expenses such as paying the front office staff, scouts, groundcrew, etc. In total, i’d bet that only amouts to 3-4 million at most, which is peanuts. And let’s not forget, the state and city paid for their beautiful cash-cow of a stadiun, which means they have a special responsibility to us that a normal business does not.

     
  • Posts: 0 joedad

    You whiny little bitch. The owners put up half the cost of the stadium which is more than most teams do. I believe the Eagles do the same. The other option would be to move out of town. Get your facts straight before you cry yourself to sleep.

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    You think paying for half the cost of a business’s facility doesn’t mean the public should hold that business to a different standard? And do you really think those owners paid one DIME out of their own pockets? Citizens Bank paid the Phillies share, buddy. Get YOUR facts straight.

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    And joedad, I wonder if you’re not actually Dave Montgtomery hiding behind some screen name, trying to do some damage control for your short sighted salary dump. Either that or you’re too stupid and blind to see what really went on.

     
  • Posts: 0 joedad

    Citizens Bank pays $2.3 million per year for the naming rights. They didn’t pay anything for the stadium bucko. After tax, the Phils have enough to pay JA Happ and some of Kyle Kendrick’s salary each year.

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    Ok Dave Montgomery, you’re right. The ownership is completely committed to winning. Cliff Lee sucked anyhow, i’m sure three A ball players will more than make up for his production. That absolutely was the right “baseball” move.

     
  • Posts: 0 joedad

    I am sick of little bitches spending other people’s money when they have none of the facts. This is the best ownership group we have in town. 3 straight NL East pennants, 2 straight NL pennants, one World Series win and took the game’s best team to the 6th game of the World Series. You pissy little k untz act as if they haven’t accomplished anything.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Anyone with bad things to say about the Phillies ownership is retarded… look at this team they’ve given us!!!

    Some people just like to cry and complain, and too many of those people post on this website lately!!

    We added Polanco and Halladay to the team that has made back-to-back World Series appearance… be thankful people!!!!

     
  • Posts: 0 GWFightinsFan

    You’re exactly the kind of sucker they love. You’ll gladly keep forking over money, without questioning their commitment. Meanwhile, they’ll do just enough to be competitive, keep you interested, but not enough to really take hold and be the premier franchise in the game. It’s quite likely this core of players won’t win another World Series, and it’ll be another 28 years or so until they stumble onto another one.

     
  • Posts: 0 joedad

    What amazes me is someone who is probably still getting an allowance from daddy acts as if $9 million salary (not including fringes) is a drop in the bucket to the owners. Payroll is $140 million. $9 million is 6.5% of the total payroll (without fringes). I dare anyone go to their employer (or daddy for allowance) and demand that they spend 6.5% more because it isn;t that much. Seriously, get a friggin clue you pouting crybabies.

     
 
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