Phillies Nation

I agree with Chuck about Werth. I outright do not understand the people saying we will go along, all jolly, without him. I don’t agree and I don’t think he is what he is b/c of the line-up. I don’t think anyone on this team stands alone, which is one of my arguments against this enormous contract signed well in advance of its need. Werth is the one who needed to be dealt with first. And btw, Ryan Howard (who I’ve always liked a lot) was NOT clutch during the WS last yr.

What Phylan said.

I may be trying to justify this move in some way because the knee-jerk reaction was an extremely negative one…but its been said a few time in comments above…RYAN HOWARD WILL PUT PEOPLE IN THE SEATS NO MATTER HOW POORLY HE IS PLAYING.

Based on statistics alone its an absolute nobrainer argument – this deal is atrocious. I have to admit that I doubt that had a whole lot to do with this decision by the Phillies to sign him long term. Ryan Howard has been the face of this franchise from the moment he came to the big leagues and they started becoming perennial winners. Its that simple. The formula has worked and thanks to his work on the field up to this point in his career the Phillies can afford to make this luxery move. The numbers are too glaringly obvious to not assume that RAJ was well aware of the risks. I just feel that they were convinced that the stability from a marketing and fanbase standpoint was superior to the potential for a major drop in production.

Howard has never and never will be as good as Barry Bonds was in his prime (juice or no juice) but I feel like you could make an argument that they have similar effects on the fans of their respective teams. When Bonds was in his last few years his production declined drastically but Giants fans would still go to the park just to see him play. Imagine in 5 years if Ryan Howard is chasing some HR milestones. CBP will be packed even if the team isn’t playing great baseball.

Another point that could be made is the absolute opposite approaches taken by the Phillies and Eagles. One team locks up their own talent and loyally commits to them despite the potential risks involved and the other continuously rotates fresh faces year after year and even quite unpopularly let’s someone of McNabb’s stature go with years left to play. Howard vs. Mcnabb:two different ways to approach a veteran…which move will be most successful…

I suggest you stop being so arrogant and condescending, Pubic…..oh, sorry, Publius.

Protection is NOT overrated at all. Doesn’t matter. Werth is a damn good player that will produce no matter where he is.

Ruben….Find a way!!

And you’d be wrong, Dipsy.

Bye bye Jayson Werth, I’ll miss your badassishness

ryan deserves every single penny CASE CLOSED!!!!!!

The Phils will sign Werth, just wait and see. He will get a nice contract because a few of the fat owners decided “What the Hell. Let’s win for at least another six more years.” I believe that they know they have a tremendous fan base in Philly and they know that we have become addicted to winning, and that we will support the team. Look at the attendance.
I agree with Dipsy when he said that baseball is a lot more lucrative than a lot of the owners let on. And the Delaware Valley is a GOLD MINE of over
10 million people — going from the Lehigh Vallley out to Reading , down to Wilmington and over the Atlantic City and up to Trenton. That is a lot of potential asses in the seats. We are the third largest media center in the entire country. Television and Pay-Per-View will add to the Phillies coffers.
We need to compete with the Yankees, Mets, Dodgers, Cubs. We have the fanbase, the team and the committment to spend the money. The Howard signing, the Halladay signing are two very good signs of a winning future. I do not believe ownership is going to approach this half-assed. Somebody has sold ownership the NEED for COMMITTMENT to WIN.

I’m on the fence about this deal. On one hand, Ryan is a great baseball player, and will be the best slugger in the history of the Phillies. On the other hand, it’s a lot of money to be paying someone until they’re 37. Also, this pretty much guarantees Jayson Werth is gone. Who’s gonna replace him? Dom Brown is left handed, and there’s no one else that can come close to the production of Werth.

ruben minaya, jr. got played once again- gave up way too much. over his head.

werth is good, but hes no howard

sorry folks

Plus, a Werth contract would not be as long-term as Howard’s. We can now go after Werth knowing that Howard will be making “only” $20 million in 2011, 2012, and 2013 –exactly the same amount he’s making now. That gives the FO a little short-term flexibility (hopefully to sign Werth to a 3 or 4-year deal, which will not overlap [much] with the final years of Ryan’s contract –when he’ll be making $25 million.

I have to also assume that one main reason they did this deal now is so they can give themselves the best possible chance to resign Werth. I do not think this is the nail in that coffin at all. What did we keep hearing from RAJ during last off-season…COST CERTAINTY. Its not always so much about how much money you are spending now but how much you have locked up down the road. In this case they now know what they have committed in the future to keep three of their most important and popular players (Howard, Utley, Halladay). This allows them to juggle their finances and prepare in such a way that they may be able to increase the budget.

They have done everything in their power to continuously lock up their own talent (I realize Werth was a free agent but he never realized any success before coming here) and se no reason why they would fail to extend Werth the same courtesy. If loyalty goes both ways and he would seek a reasonable deal I bet they go over $140 team salary for a few years to make it happen.

Here’s a thought:

RAJ signed Howard first to show COMMITMENT to WINNING to potential FAs, which Werth will soon be.

This has all been laid out. Werth can see the desire to win on the part of ownership and may agree to a slight discount to stay.

At first, I thought that Werth should be the priority with all the re-signings…but the more I think about it maybe this is the way to go.

Still….this is a HUGE contract. I hope it doesn’t come back to bite us.

“I see Ruall being traded soon and Brown to come up that is just me”

- even if you find someone dumb enough to take ibanez, we’re still paying for most of the contract or eating an equally burdensome one in return.

who said he was. we’re saying one w/o the other can potentially cripple this lineup. It’s amazing that Werth continues to mash despite Raul Ibanez’s prolonged struggles. Watch Werth on another team next yr and you’ll be singing a diff tune guaranteed. Victorino, Ibanez, Brown or a fa signing will be the OF in 2011 if Werth goes. The moment the season ends Reggie Jackson will be waiting outside the locker room to drive him to Yankee stadium and give Werth a tour of his new home.

I definitely think that gets it done, Chuck. I don’t see how Werth could make more than $15 per year, as talented as he is. I think the key here is to offer something reasonable before his current contract expires and not wait till FA when the bidding wars and speculation push the price up.

so did Johnny Damon…Green has special healing powers. No honestly it does. I’m not saying Howard doesn’t deserve the dough. I’m happy for him. Just hoping we can keep Werth too that’s all. In fact, I’m gonna send my single younger sister to his house once the Phils return from the road trip to see if she can work her magic one time. Just imagine being able to brag ” Dude Ryan Howard is banging my sister and I’m cool with it.” at the next company picnic.

In the 2006 Baseball Prospectus book, Baseball Between the Numbers, they pretty thoroughly debunk the notion of Lineup Protection. Page 42, if anyone’s looking.

There’s always Pat Brrrrrrellll…. He’ll be a fa after the season I think… Yeah….. exactly… The Phils need to take a fan vote on rasing ticket prices a little in order to keep Werth. Assuming projected increased revenue from raised ticket proces wasn’t the deciding factor in the Doc/Howard deals.

Repeat! – If you send your little sis over there, make her use protection cuz I don’t wanna catch anything. Thanks in advance for the solid.

I think Ryan has reached the point where his value has transcended the numbers he puts up on a baseball field. While we watch the metamorphosis from fat, strikeout prone, non fielding, home run or nothing hitter, to conscientious, lean, hard working and more well rounded baseball player, he is also on the verge of becoming a civic treasure. You can’t let a guy like that go. Its bad business. Guys like A-Rod can get traded because their pricks but to trade a guy like Howard, or to let him walk, would be bad business. The P.R. hit would be monumental. Ryan has the “qwan”.

Its a lot of money and I don’t know if he’s worth it. I don’t think there exists a metric to gauge how good a 25m guy has to be in order to earn his money. But I’m glad he’s staying.

The Dipsy

Hmmm, this much money being thrown around makes me wonder if Cliff could have been extended???
Pray Ibanez can be moved. I know Victorino can be moved. Say good bye to Moyer after the season. 2011 OF: Francisco, Werth, Brown.
Back to intended thread… Howard, along with Utley and Rollins, have to be career Phils. Today is a good day.

Wait a second. Ryan’s goin out with a white chick? Damn…..I have enough trouble scaring up my own white chicks without Ryan dipping into the talent pool. It says in the article that she’s got 6 seasons as a Eagles cheerleader “under her belt”. Yeah, that and a few cheeseburgers. She’s a tad stout.

The Dipsy

Yeah you’re right Edr. Besides my sister would never ever be unfaithful to the Dipsy. Even though the Dipsy keeps pressuring her to get a sex change operation because he’s only attracted to men that look like Clay Akins. You should’ve told her that before u married her and knocked her up with twins. Now you’re stuck. haha….

My uncle used to run this smal Jazz club in Center City a few yrs back. Ryan Howard and his dates used to come in there 2x a month or so. He said that Ryan Howard always had a different chick on his arm and it always was a bang’n white chick. Not that it matters, blank is blank to me.