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Odds and Ends: Lidge, Contreras, Lineup

Posted by Pat Gallen, Fri, May 21, 2010 09:37 AM | Comments: 40
Analysis, News, Odds And Ends, Opinion, Posts

-Brad Lidge will throw from flat ground today before the Phillies take on the Boston Red Sox; another step in his recovery since hitting the DL last week.  The Phillies closer has a cortisone injection (his fifth in a year; not a good sign) but said he should be ready to go once he comes off the DL next week.

Manuel and Dubee are going to have to take it slow with him before ramping him up into high-pressure and 9th inning situations. With Contreras doing a fantastic job in his new role, and the bullpen as a whole staying fresh, it should be easy for the coaching staff to ease Lidge back into his familiar setting.  They cannot risk another set back.

-Speaking of Contreras, the guy has been awesome. One thought about that shaky ninth inning he had yesterday: that’s the sort of inning that makes a pitcher believe he can accomplish anything out on the mound. Contreras had a big smile after the game as his buddy Danys Baez translated for him, and why not?  He’s flourishing in a role unfamiliar to him.

They call him “Big Truck” – well at least Charlie does now, because of the big vehicle he drives – and he’s been coming up big in the absence of the aforementioned Lidge. With 1st and 3rd and no one out, Jose got three straight outs.  The dude already has a boatload of confidence right now, as his ERA sits below one.  Wiggling out of that jam is something that sticks in your head for a long while.  Who knew Jose Contreras would be as valuable as he’s been thus far.  Don’t forget, the guy still has some starter in him; meaning if the time is right, he can go more than just three outs.

-The lineup is certainly a hot issue these days with Jimmy Rollins returning and everyone finally healthy together.  My question to you was – as stated in the Phillies Nation Phancast Video yesterday – where do you put Raul Ibanez and Jimmy Rollins now?

Give us your best eight man batting order below.

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About Pat Gallen

Pat Gallen has written 1666 articles on Phillies Nation.

Pat is Editor-in-Chief of Phillies Nation. He also covers the Phils for 97.5 FM in Philly.

 
 
  • Posts: 0 Bev Miller

    Victorino
    Rollins
    Utley
    Howard
    Ibanez
    Werth
    Ruiz
    Polanco

     
  • Posts: 0 billy

    You keep the lineup the same as it was opening day. Rollins was taking a few more pitches then previous years. Hopefully Victorino can keep his hot streak going back in the 7 hole and Chooch can keep up the good work getting on base & turning the line-up over. We need to manufacture some more runs though, as in stealing bases.

     
  • Posts: 0 Larry H Saltz

    Victorino
    Rollins
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Polanco
    Ibanez
    Ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 Garo

    Bev: very creative, very LaRussa-like.
    My suggestion:
    Against lefties:
    Rollins
    Polanco
    Utley
    Werth
    Howard
    Victorino
    Ibanez
    Ruiz

    Against Righties:
    Rollins
    Polanco
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Ibanez
    Victorino
    Ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 Joe M.

    I think our lineup should be: Rollins, Polanco, Utley, Howard, Werth, Victorino, Ibanez, Ruiz

    To me, that is our best line-up by far

     
  • Posts: 0 Bob in Bucks

    Rollins
    Polanco
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Victorino
    Ibanzez
    Ruiz

    Victorino is showing a lot more power than Ibanez so move him up. Ruiz is showing the right discipline for #8. This all presumes that Rollins can run. If not, switch Rollins/Victorino.

     
  • Posts: 0 bfo_33

    Agree with Billy. While Rollins may not be a prototypical lead-off guy, he is not as feast or famine as Vic. Victorino had a great early May, but he is going to have at least one terrible week each month, where he looks like he is swinging blindfolded. He’s much better suited to the 7 hole (plus if he gets on base, it is almost a guarenteed free pass to Ruiz, turning the line-up over faster). For those who will state that this is “jumping off the bandwagon”, while I always thought Vic has the physical tools to bat leadoff, I never liked him in that spot (or the 2 hole). He is not a good situational hitter (unless the situation is swing for the fences).

    Hopefully, Rollins can find his patience from early April against the Sox – the three we’re facing don’t throw a lot of strikes (against Dice K, first time through the line-up, wouldn’t let anyone swing unless there are two strikes – he’ll throw 100 pitches in the 1st 4 innings – Wakefield is either on or off – find out by making him throw a lot of pitches, swing only at the “fastball”). Sounds easy (but I know it isn’t).

    My only concern with Contreras is will he hold up at the current load. Bring Lidge back very slowly, with the thought that we may need him Aug/Sept/Oct.

     
  • Posts: 0 Mike

    Victorino
    Polanco
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Rollins
    Ibanez
    Ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Batting order: same as Mike’s above.

    ———-

    Contreras=STUD !!!!!!!

     
  • Posts: 0 The Original Chuck P

    I think that you automatically slot in Polly 2, Utley 3, Howard 4 and Werth 5… we’ve had this discussion before and I’m in the camp that believes that as long as we are winning pennants and as long as Ryan Howard is wearing Red Pinstripes, he deserves to bat cleanup (lefty, righty… it doesn’t matter). If Rollins is healthy and if his preference is to lead off, he goes there. So 1-5 is set… from there, I’m thinking about the strengths of each player and how to get the most out of them. Ruiz is an on base machine. Vic is a speedster; he can put the ball in play which means that he can produce runs with men on third and he has home run potential. Ibanez is probably the best pure hitter of those three in that he can drive the ball into the gaps either way and he knows how to do what needs to be done in any given situation. Turning the lineup over is really important and for that reason I think that Ruiz bats 8th. I think that I would slot Vic 6th so that he’s sees plenty of opportunities to drive in runs and so that Ibanez isn’t slowing him down. So my lineup looks like this:

    Rollins
    Polly
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Vic
    Ibanez
    Ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 WorldFudgeChamp

    This might seem crazy but here is mine:

    Vic
    Polly
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Ibanez
    Ruiz
    Rollins (He would be more of a threat down at the line up so when the top of the lineup in due he is already on base)

     
  • Posts: 0 billy

    Right now we have only 2 starters that are batting less then .300 which is amazing & also makes you wonder why we are so streaky at scoring runs. Ibanez seems like he is slowly coming around since he has raised his average to almost .250. Victorino isnt far from his career average of approx .280. hence we i think we go back to our “normal” lineup start manufacturing runs up & down our lineup like National league teams do.

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    I would have Werth as my clean-up guy. Howard strikes out more then Manny at a bar. Howard kills you as a clean up guy. Rollins batting 6th or 7th. He does not take pitches as a lead off. The only two people that think he should be up there are him and chollie.

     
  • Posts: 0 Scott in D.C.

    Madson and Lidge both would’ve blown the game after hitting the lead batter — let alone after giving up the single. Really impressive performance…

     
  • Posts: 0 Paul

    I like,

    Rollins
    Polanco
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Victorino
    Ibanez
    Ruiz

    I think Vic offers a little better protection behind Werth than Ibanez does…

     
  • [...]  The Phillies need a closer. "What? No we [...]

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    We should have Lineup A, Lineup B, Lineup C …..

    because I think a couple different people already posted their BEST lineup..

    Rollins, Polanco, Utley,
    Howard, Werth, Victorino,
    Ibanez, Ruiz, Lee

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Since tickets to the BlueJays series are FULL PRICE …. that should generate enough extra money to keep Werth, right??

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    Gate money goes to the Jays. Just forget Werth. He is gone. The phillies will never pay him the money he will be asking. I dont blame them. Look at Bay. The Yankees and Sox will be in a bidding war for Jason. End of story. This is first and only chance to cash in. He will BIG time. We need pitching. Thats why I hate the Howard contract. I would of kept him for his two years remaining. His production will go down. His power will diminish. Pitching is key.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Original Chuck P

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    It would have to be for more money than Jason Bay got paid… so maybe a 5 year, $75- 80 M deal?

    He would possibly be leaving $20 M on the table to stay here.. but that’s a ton of money if he signs for $15-16 M per season ….


    Pitching is key.. but Howard puts butts in seats every single night. he was the fastest players in MAJOR LEAGUE HISTORY .. to 100 HR … to 150 HR.. and to 200 HR


    Roy Oswalt is now 2-6, for a Houston team that’s going nowhere ….any chance the Phillies put up an offer to grab him? Lots of minor league depth in the OF .. maybe??

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    I mentioned this on here either yesterday or the day before…..that Mike Missanelli had Jayson Stark on his program earlier in the week and he (Stark) said that….and I am paraphrasing….

    “The Phillies will NOT let Jayson Werth get away”.

    Stark was referencing a conversation he had with a fairly credible source and that source flat out said that Werth will remain a Phillie.

    Stark is someone I have a lot of faith in and I don’t think he would just come on Missanelli’s show and say something that didn’t have some truth to it.

    Stay tuned, I guess……

     
  • Posts: 0 Sam

    1. Rollins
    2. Victorino
    3. Utley
    4. Howard
    5. Werth
    6. Polanco
    7. Ibanez
    8. Ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff Y.

    1. JRoll
    2. Polanco
    3. Utley
    4. Werth
    5. Howard (split the lefties up)
    6. Victorino
    7. Chooch
    8. Ibanez

     
  • Posts: 0 JimPhils

    Give werth more ab’s and put him on for Howard to clean up.

    1 rollins
    2 utley
    3 werth
    4 howard
    5 victorino
    6 polanco
    7 ibanez
    8 ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 Pat

    Vs. Righties:
    1. Rollins
    2. Polanco
    3. Utley
    4. Howard
    5. Werth
    6. Victorino
    7. Ibanez
    8. Ruiz

    Vs. Lefties:
    1. Victorino
    2. Polanco
    3. Utley
    4. Werth
    5. Ibanez
    6. Rollins
    7. Howard
    8. Ruiz

    Howard struggles badly enough against lefties and Werth and Ibanez hit them well enough that I think it justifies dropping him down. Remember that with this lineup there is no real “weakest spot” it’s just different. Though Ruiz is playing so well I think he’s invaluable in the 8 spot in getting on base to either get the pitcher to bunt guys over with less than 2 outs or get him out of the way with 2 outs. I think the 6 spot should be reserved for a 2nd leadoff hitter after 3, 4, and 5 knock in the guys on base or get themselves out the previous inning. I think Victorino hits lefties a little better than Rollins which is why I have the switch in 1 and 6 spots

     
  • Posts: 0 Kyle

    Why not hit the pitcher eighth. I’ve always hated this but it might not be a bad idea.

    Rollins, Polanco, Utley, Howard, Werth, Ibanez, Ruiz, Pitcher, Victorino

    LaRussa dis this a lot last year.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    LaRussa tries to reinvent the game… bat your worst hitter in the lowest spot (the pitcher hitting 9th) …

    Howard batting 7th vs lefties is ridiculous…. when that guy leaves the game in the 6th-7th inning, .. and in those crucial final innings, against Righty relievers.. there aren’t 6 guys on the team I want to get extra at-bats before Ryan Howard would get his chance …

    Also … Polanco is as pure a #2 hitter as there is in baseball … he’s staying there

    the only real question is Rollins 1st or 6th
    If Rollins bats 1st (as expected) does Victorino or Ibanez hit 6th/7th

     
  • Posts: 0 Bob

    Victorino
    Rollins
    Utley
    Howard
    Werth
    Ibanez
    Polanco
    Ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    They could make THIS the order, and still be the best team in NL:

    Ruiz
    Utley
    Werth
    Victorino
    Polanco
    Howard
    Rollins
    Ibanez

     
  • Posts: 0 Keeg

    Victorino needs to be at the top of the lineup. We saw what happened at the beginning of the season with him down at the 7 hole – he was batting well below .250 and now he’s absolutely hot up there at the top. I agree with Bob whole heartedly. Vic and Rollins are switchable in the 1-2 hole but move Polanco down to give the bottom of the order some pop after Ibanez. I love that lineup on paper and would love to see how it works in game. 3-4-5 would obviously stay the same. Ruiz would stay at the 8 hole but I just think Victorino has a different mind set towards the bottom of the order and it’s not a good one.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ben

    don m is right about polly, he’s the quintessential second hitter. would be crazy to have him hit anywhere else in the line up. heres what i’d suggest.

    righties:
    rollins
    polly
    utley
    howard
    werth
    ibanez
    victorino
    ruiz

    lefties:
    rollins
    polly
    utley
    werth
    howard
    victorino
    ibanez
    ruiz

    but in actuality, i’m fine with what charlie normally does, and march out the same line up every night (which would be the righty lineup i have above).

     
  • Posts: 0 shag beta sigma delta

    Aren’t Howards splits a lot better this year, dosn’t he have like 9 hits in a row off of lefties? So for all of you living in the past moving Ryan any day of the week out of the four hole just does not float with me. Also have to agree 100% with those who say Polonco will stay and should stay in the 2 hole. 2-5 is pretty much set in stone, PP, Utley, Howard, Wreth. I think Charlie will move JRoll to lead off where he is best suited for this team. And Vic’s start might just have been a slow start. He is not a #2 hitter so with Jimmy back at lead off, you put Vic 6th I think. He has been an RBI machine while Chooch and Jimmy’s replacements were getting on base at a .400 clip. So why not put him 6th.

     
  • Posts: 0 Valentin King

    victorino
    polanco
    utley
    howard
    werth
    rollins
    ibanez
    ruiz

     
  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Jayson Werth is going to remain a Phil. Bank it. They have to keep him and they know it.

    I would love to get Oswalt, but with Werth staying(IMO) there won’t be $$$$. Any starter the Phils sign would be Pedro in a prorated deal.

    Don’t count out Scott Eyre as an option.

     
  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Howard does KO a lot, but A. Gonzalez, A. Pujoles and R. Zimmerman all grounded into twice as many DPs as Howard. 23,22,22 and 11.

     
  • Posts: 0 Manny

    Right now, I’d keep it simple, only leaving open the possibility of switching Raul with Shane in the 6th or 7th spot, depending on who’s carrying the hotter bat.

    At least for now, dropping Shane from 1st to 7th seems a bit too drastic, especially when he has produced in the leadoff spot when Jimmy was out. So I’d let him bat 6th unless he gets cold, or Ibanez gets hot.

    I’d say that once Jimmy can run and steal 100% and everything returns to normal, you’d do:

    1. Jimmy
    2. Polanco
    3. Chase
    4. Ryno
    5. Werth
    6. Vic / Raul
    7. Raul / Vic
    8. Chooch
    9. Pitcher

     
  • Posts: 0 RyanW

    Curious what everyone thinks about Roy Oswalt requesting to be traded from the Astros today…Think the Phillies could pick him up? That would be a sick pitching staff if he were added.

     
  • Posts: 0 Brian Sr. of CO

    Chuck I wish I could agree, but I honestly think Werth is gone sadly. As for Contreras, its funny how time changes things. When the phillies signed him almost everyone on here said “He sucks” “Bum” the list goes on. Now hes a stud. Granted he is pitching like a freakin stud! The rest of the bullpen is VERY inconsistent. One day they all look like studs, the next day they look like Brad Lidge pitching against Pujols.

     
  • Posts: 0 coach sling bags

    Thanks for sharing, Such nice infomations. Regards.Welcome to say something about my recent shopping experience:coach handbags outlet ,coach purses.

     
 
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