Notes From the Winter Meetings: Wednesday

Posted by Pat Gallen, Wed, December 08, 2010 11:40 PM | Comments: 123
2010-11 Free Agency, Analysis, News, Opinion, Posts

-Yes, you heard correctly – Zack Greinke. Is it possible? Yes. Is it likely? No. The hottest rumor out of the Winter Meetings thus far pertaining to the Phillies is that they are “considering” the Royals ace and Cy Young winner.  A person with knowledge of the situation told Jim Salisbury of CSNPhilly.com that the Phillies brass has had internal discussions as well as talks with Kansas City about Greinke. Amaro said:

“We have explored and tried and talked about acquiring some significant players,” he said. “We’ve tried to shoot for the moon on some things and laid some groundwork, but the possibility of them happening is kind of remote.”

Unlikely as it may be, Ruben and his boys are stirring things up a bit down in Central Florida. It’s not as crazy as it sounds, but what would it cost? If Cole Hamels is involved, you stay away. Hamels fits beautifully in between the two Roy’s, so you don’t want to mess with that. In no uncertain terms, the Royals organization will pillage the Phils farm system – that’s a given. Dom Brown would have to be involved – also a given.

This trade rumor barely as legs, but it’s a big one nonetheless.

-Dennys Reyes still isn’t a Phillie, however, he could be one soon. There have been multiple reports today of him signing with the team, although nothing has been completed. It would be for one-year with a second-year option.

-Aaron Rowand is not coming to Philadelphia, so says Giants GM Brian Sabean. He said the rumors surrounding his expensive, little-used outfielder are conjecture. This one could be a possibility, especially if the Giants pay most of his remaining salary. He’s a guy the Phillies know well; he’s also a guy the Giants would love to unload. Keep an eye on this, it may have legs. Am I fan of it? Not really, but the market is thinned out after Matt Diaz and Jeff Francouer signed.

-Is Magglio worth it? Scott Boras, his agent-extraordinare, says the bidding begins at two-years, $20 million. If that number comes down a bit, then the Phillies might be on to something. However, I’m just not sure if he’s worth $10 million a year. I’m also not so sure Carlos Peña is worth $10 million a season either, but that’s what the Cubs gave him, so anything’s possible.

UPDATE, 9:00 AM Thursday: While I was tucked away in bed, Dennys Reyes finally signed a contract with the Phillies; go figure. The deal is worth $1.1 million in 2011 and there is a mutual option worth $1.35 million in 2012. If Reyes reaches 70 appearances this year, he’ll have the right to exercise that. There is also a $150,000 buyout in ’12.

Not a bad deal for a lefty who will have to remember how to stop lefties. Then again, this seems to be the going rate for guys of his caliber nowadays. Just yesterday, George Sherrill signed a similar contract with the Atlanta Braves. Reyes can’t be any worse than J.C. Romero was in his final year-and-a-half in Philly, and for less than half the price.

UPDATE, 9:12 am Thursday: In the Rule 5 draft, the Phillies selcted Michael Martinez, an infielder from the Washington Nationals. Martinez, 28, is a light-hitting, switch-hitter who has been a minor league lifer. In AAA last season, he had a .720 OPS and played five positions.

They’ll get a better look at him during Spring Training to see if he’s worth keeping for an entire season. By the looks of his numbers, it’s a long shot. If the Phillies do not keep him, he will have to be offered back to the Nats.

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  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Fascinating about Greinke. I’d sacrifice lots of farm talent, including Brown if we could have a top 4 of Doc, Hamels, Oswalt, & The Great Greinke. Theyd obviously turn around and move Blanton as a salary dump. Let a bunch of leftover prospects, Kendrick, Eddie Bonine, etc, compete for 5th.

    That’d be awesome.

    Then you turn around and sign a Magglio to fill the gap in RF.

  • Posts: 0 MikeB.

    No way would I include Dom Brown in the mix for Greinke.

  • Posts: 0 Dan

    I think Rowand could find new life if he returned to the Phils. He has great relationships with a lot of the players here. The question is who you would have to part with.

  • Posts: 0 bsizzle

    I really like Greinke. But I also really don’t like the idea of basically emptying out what’s left of our farm system for someone who’d be our #4 pitcher. Sure, he’d be the greatest #4 in the world, but the benefits dont outweigh the costs.

  • Posts: 0 Andrew from waldorf

    If you got Grienke there would have to be another move of Hamels or oswalt. You cant have 4 sick good pitchers.

  • Posts: 0 Roy Burson

    Get Greinke dump Brown in the deal or Mayberry don’t bring Rowand back get a solid RF win with pitching and defense!

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Youd trade Blanton, bring in basically anyone off the street to be 5th, and have the best top 4 assembled in a long time.

  • Posts: 0 Paul Owens

    Blanton would have to be a piece of what goes to KC. Blanton, Rizzotti (sp) and James maybe? But we also get Alex Gordon. Toss in Kendrick too if you have to.

  • Posts: 0 Andrew

    Down. I don’t like what we’d have to unload, but imagine that starting 4.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Crawford to Boston basically a notch above Werths deal.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    7 for 142, damn..boston is gonna be sick.

  • Posts: 0 Lefty

    No to Grienke, as fun as it sounds, we can’t gut our farm system or give up any young MLers. They’re not going to take Blanton, Raul and a bunch of garbage for him. Just no.

    I love the idea of Rowand if we’re only paying half or less of his salary. Ibanez could go back to the west coast, and be the next Pat Burell, Edgar Renteria type they seem to like so much.

    I have loudly been touting Magglio for quite a while, but that is no longer seems wise at 17 or 18 over 2. I was thinking more like 10/2. We have people to pay next year and for years after. Might just have to settle for BenFran/Gload- or BenFran/Brown if he makes it in Spring.

    @psujoe from the other thread- I know Sherrill quite well, as I live near Baltimore. He’s just okay, or better yet, inconsistent is the right word. I also don’t believe he thinks of himself as a Loogy and could be a malcontent. I repeat, Braves can have him.

  • Posts: 0 jeff

    Baseball is becoming a joke. First werthless with that big contract. Now Crawford to the Red Sox for 7 years 145 million. Its out of control. What about the Royals, Pirates, etc. This is why the NFL is the best in the world. You do not know who will win. In baseball you do. I hope this sport gets runied with these big deals.

  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Boston’s lineup is sick! If there pitching returns to baseline, game over for Yanks.

    With a 10.53% tax rate(NY state+NYC) of 10.53% Rangers should be able to beat Yanks. If you’re Cliff do you want to face the Sox or the Angels/A’s/Mariners?

  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Lee should stay with the Rangers considering it’s 10.5+% less in taxes in a much easier division.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    The NFL is not the best in the world by far. It is the most hypocritical league in the whole world. It is stuffed full of criminals who have actually killed people and yet are there making millions while people starve. Tell me how baseball is worse? There is absolutely no defense for the disgraceful morally bankrupt sideshow that the NFL is today.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    BTW – Reyes is officialy coming here – 1 year 1.1M with mutual option for a second year at 1.35M

  • Posts: 0 Lefty

    The Tampa Rays can kiss next season goodbye before Christmas.

    The Red Sawx are stacked.

  • Posts: 0 Lefty

    Dennys grand slam breakfast is coming to town. He’s going to make Joe B look slim.

  • Posts: 0 alex

    I am completely against trying to get Grienke. Sure he’s good, but he has never pitched in pressure and he has a history with anxiety issues. He’s perfect in a small market but I could see the same thing happening to him that happened to Vazquez when he went to NYY(just flat out forget what to do with a baseball in his hands). For what he’d cost in terms of money and players, it just wouldn’t work out well for us.

  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    His ST Louis nickname is the Big Sweat, haha

  • Posts: 0 brooks

    Lefty I like it! Dennys Grand Slam breakfast – hahah!

  • Posts: 0 brooks

    I guess with Dennys here, Joe could still be cheeseburger and Dennys Cheesecake?

  • Posts: 0 Andrew from waldorf

    Red sox have to be the favorites now to win the WS
    Crawford is the real deal.

  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    This hasn’t been one of the Phillies’ best winters.

    I’m Ted Bell.

  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Not YET, Ted.

  • Posts: 0 bfo_33

    I’m not against depleting the farm for an impact player, and several of our best prospects are currently blocked anyway, but not sold on Grienke. How long is he signed for? Getting him wouldn’t do a thing a for 2011. The division will not be good next year. On paper, the Phils already have the pitching to win it, who cares if you take it by 1 game or 20. Unless an injury to H2O, he probably wouldn’t even pitch in the playoffs. This would be for 2012 and beyond, and I think there may be a few more pressing needs.

    I’d take Rowand if the Giants pay the majority of his contract, and he’s willing to accept the role of bench/platoon player. He’s a reckless fielder, and his power is pretty much gone. He couldn’t crack the outfield of the Giants, which short of Burrell’s hot streak, was pretty offensively challenged in the later half of the year.

    If the Sox have any pitching next year, they are going to be real tough. The Yanks are now really going to overpay for Lee, or may be out of contention next year.

  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Greinke? Why? No. Like the Reyes deal. Whats not to like?

    The Dipsy

  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Greinke has those anxiety issues, right?? I can’t see him playing in the NL East with all that pressure.

    I think people are feeding off the St Louis fanbase with Reyes. Apparantely they don’t like him anymore? Maybe he fell out of favor with La Russa? But I think for the price, it’s worth it. (I STILL don’t get the Sherrill thing though)

    Aaron Rowand?? Really?? I just can’t see it. I’d go after Maggs for 2/15.

  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    Reyes had a lot of control issues last year, but relievers are so unpredictable that he could be fine in 2011. Apparently, they’re close to an agreement with Durbin also.

    This outfield continues to be concern – offensively and defensively.

    I’m Ted Bell.

  • Posts: 0 jeff of Nova

    Can we all say I mentioned it first:):)

    I glad to see the Phils are at least making the look for Greinke!

  • Posts: 0 robbie e

    Just the fact that Cole Hamels was mentioned scared the crap out of me! Are the Phillies even thinking of using him in a trade? Some team must have inquired or it wouldn’t have come up.

  • Posts: 0 Dan

    I hope Reyes is an upgrade over J.C. Romero. In any case I think the lefty of the future is Bastardo. Old friend David Herndon is on the same team as him in winter ball and is also doing very well.

  • Posts: 0 George

    Amaro isn’t stupid; he’s not going to trade Hamels for Greinke, because that would be a wash or maybe even worse given Greinke’s social anxiety problems.

    The reason for looking, though, is that there is the possibility that Oswalt retires when his current contract runs out, which I believe is the end of this year. He’s talked about it. If he does, the Phils will certainly want someone to take his place.

    Ordonez will be asking for too much money, especially considering he’s pretty old and coming off an injury.

    I’m okay with Reyes. He may turn out to be a bargain, but if not, he came really cheap. He might cost the Phils a game or two, but if he does, Manuel will simply stop using him in key situations.

    Rowand won’t be moved right away unless the Giants cough up a big piece of change to pay him. This is one to watch, though. Rowand wouldn’t need so much power to hit one out at CBP, he still plays decent defense, and he could spell Victorino in center from time to time.

  • Posts: 0 NJ

    Firstly on Reyes I wouldn’t think Reyes is going to be an upgrade over Romero, I’d assume the Phillies signed him as a handle to Bastardo in the hope he can take a big leap this year. Remember Charlie gave him a lot of chances last year to pitch to both lefties and righties and not just in lost games.

    Secondly I guess it’s no surprise there’s been so few rumors on Maggs with Boras posturing to the tune of $20m, no way he gets that with the way the Tigers trashed his rep last year.

    Rowand would have been nice.

  • Posts: 0 Scotch Man

    If Hamels is involved, no way I’d deal for Greinke. But if they can swing it without him, even with Dom Brown, I’d be for it.

  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Reyes is fine. Better than the J.C. post suspension – not as good as J.C. pre- suspension. I have an idea for a lefty reliever. How about J.C. Romero? If he’s meandering out there a week before spring training, why not offer him a minor league contract? Or maybe a mill? Would he take it? I don’t know.

    This Greinke stuff is nuts. Lets stop.

    When we are thinking of what kinda RH bat we’re going to get, lets try to think like Rube. Its his last year with Oswalt, Lidge, Madson, Rollins. Why would he short change the team with some half assed Brown or Gload/Francisco platoon in RF? It makes no sense. He would be shortchanging his squad during a year where it MIGHT be their last best chance to win the series for a while. Her owes it to the team to get a big bat. IMO.

    The Dipsy

  • Posts: 0 NJ

    Unless a major pitching move is again made or his production (or health) falls off a cliff I’d expect the Phils to pick up Oswalts 2012 option since his buyout is so big.

    I’d expect us to re-sign Rollins or lets be honest (as sad as it would make us for him to leave) the Phils could easily replace his production over the last couple of years, have Vic leading off permanently and allocate that money elsewhere which would also give greater line-up flexibility.

    Madson will probably get a stupid deal elsewhere and Lidge will probably leave, just prey we don’t give up our 1st round pick and more money than the national debt of Ireland to sign Jonathan freakin’ Papelborn.

    The Phils have options for RF this year. A lot more options coming on the market for next year though.

  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Big Bat = Magglio Ordonez.

    2y/15M. …. Screw Scott Boras

  • Posts: 0 NJ

    Dipsy- as an insider maybe you should start the ‘Phillies Nation campaign for Maggs’

    Only thing is isn’t there a knock on his personality as a positive in the clubhouse…?

  • Posts: 0 Mike N

    No way on Greinke. He would cost a TON in prospects, probably Dom Brown plus several of our outstanding single A pitching prospects.

    Ordonez for two years at 7.5/per I would consider. Put him in right this year, then in 2012 when Ibanez is gone move Maggs to left and bring up brown. That helps our right/lefty balance and allows Brown to move at his own pace. Of course, if Brown is really ready that changes things a bit.

  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    Besides the fact that Ordonez is about to turn 37 and is coming off of a broken ankle (Victorino should ask for a raise if he’s put in a situation where he’s playing between Ibanez and Ordonez), he has publically stated that he wants to stay in Detroit. He probably will…the Detroit websites seem to think it’s a slam dunk that he returns.

    There has to be better options…it’s up to RAJ to find them.

    I’m Ted Bell.

  • Posts: 0 Matt Kwasiborski

    The Phils track record of developing pitchers in house is very low outside of Hamels, Madson. The other pick that may be successful was used to land Doc (Drabek). And Savery, the other former #1 pick is not converting to be a position player. Point is, it seems easier to develop position players than Cy Young Award winners. Going after Grienke hard is something we should do. Yes, one of them will be a #4 pitcher next year but after that but Oswalt is only signed through 2011 (option for 2012).

    Getting Grienke and filling the holes is a successful plan- look at the Giants- they are the blueprint now for how to win. The Giants core are their 4 starting pitchers and Posey and fill in the gaps along the way. A core rotation of Doc, Hamels, and Grienke post 2011 would keep us in contention for alot longer.

  • Posts: 0 NJ

    On the face of it the free agent RH corner outfielders available cheap right now are:

    Scott Hairston, Ryan Ludwick, Austin Kearns, Jermaine Dye, Delwyn Young, Xavier Nady, Half-assing Milleadge

    Trade options: Ryan Doumit, Corey Hart, Josh Willingham, Juan Rivera, maybe Nick Swishers available

    And that’s pretty much your lot for right now…

  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    SHerril > Reyes at disposing of lefties however he is an upgrae over Herndon.

    No need to break the farm for a pitcher. If you break the farm you do it for a power bat in the OF.

  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Ted, I heard that too about him staying in Detroit. Good relationships with several of his teammates and Jim Leyland apparantely loves him. It’s probably a long shot…but worth at least exploring and moving on. Who knows…

  • Posts: 0 NJ

    If it made sense for the Phillies to land Grienke then why doesn’t it make more sense for the Giants to go for him? or the Braves who have the prospects to add him?

    If it was easy making trades and winning championships as is discussed here there would be a french revolution style take over of front offices.

    The Phillies can develop pitching, we haven’t had the space or better yet the merry-go round pitching staffs the teams with the best young pitching have (and in most cases have paid big bonus’s for)… Would you have liked it if the Phils have drafted Rick Porcello now? The guy would be getting chased out of town like Gavin Floyd.

  • Posts: 0 jeff

    yea and baseball is filled with cheating steroid adicts. give me a break. atleast the NFL is a league with balance. unless your the yankees or boston there is no balance.

  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Yanks offer Lee 7/156. That is ridiculous for a 32 year old pitcher who was in theminors 4 years ago.

    Lee should still go to Texas because he’ll save 10% on all home games versus NY.


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