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Why Flande, Sanchez Were Released

Posted by Jay Floyd, Wed, December 08, 2010 08:22 AM | Comments: 164
Blueclaws, Minor Leagues, Posts

While several free agent and potential trade names have been floated around at this week’s Winter Meetings in Orlando, Florida, with the Phillies organization attached to them, the moves that the Phils have actually made were of minimal impact at the minor league level.  In an effort to clear space on their 40-man roster, the Phillies released pitchers Yohan Flande (pictured) and Jesus Sanchez.

Flande, a Dominican lefty hurler that will turn 25 years old prior to spring training, is currently pitching for the Toros in the Dominican Winter Baseball League. In 6 games (4 starts), Flande has posted a 1-1 record with a 4.91 ERA and a .303 batting average against, for the Toros. In 27 starts for the Double A Reading Phillies this year, Flande went 10-8 with a 4.38 ERA.

The right-handed Sanchez performed well this season with the High A level Clearwater Threshers as a starting pitcher. In 23 games (22 starts), Sanchez, who turned 23 years old after the season, posted a 9-7 record with a 2.99 ERA. Sanchez was a key pitcher on the Lakewood BlueClaws team that won the South Atlantic League championship in 2009. He was also the last remaining player that the Phillies acquired in the trade that sent Bobby Abreu to the Yankees in 2006.

Flande and Sanchez were among players added to the Phillies’ 40-man roster in November 2009 to protect them from last year’s Rule 5 draft, the annual selection process aimed at preventing teams from stock piling too much talent in the minors and leaving players there to relatively waste away. Each pitcher is now available to any team that wants to claim them off waivers.  Currently, the Phillies’ 40-man roster sits at 38 total players.

According to multiple reports, the Phillies will attempt to reach new contractual agreements with Flande and Sanchez. Each pitcher would need to clear waivers before that happens.

What do these moves translate to? The Phillies likely have their sights set on some players, that they feel two 40-man roster spots could be better utilized on.  Those players could be new Major League acquisitions or prospects they’ll target in the Rule 5 draft this coming Thursday, December 9th. And with so many pitching prospects outshining Flande and Sanchez this season, the organization must not feel too concerned about potentially losing one or both of these individuals.

MANUEL AND AMARO AT LAKEWOOD

In other news from the organization, the Lakewood BlueClaws announced that their parent club, the Phillies, would be making a stop at the Woodlake Country Club in Lakewood, NJ on Wednesday, January 26th, 2011, as part of the club’s Winter Tour. Phillies manager Charlie Manuel and general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. will be on hand. Registration for the dinner event is $40 per person and proceeds will benefit BlueClaws charities. To sign up, click here, or contact Amy DeMichele at 732-901-7000 ext 172.

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  • Posts: 0 bfo_33

    I get Flande, but kind of surprised about Sanchez. He’s only been a pitcher for a few years, has had early success, and seems to have a ton of potential. I guess you can’t keep everyone, yet seems like Zagurski or Bocock would have been the better choices to leave off.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    Why are players that we don’t need anymore, players that we could care less if other teams just took them for nothing, protected on the 40 man. For instance, I think that we would all be happy if Ibanez was claimed by another team makes, or Baez. Why do we have to protect them. I honestly don’t know the rule.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    Thats a good point there, there must be an obvious reason why players who would go unclaimed are protected (unless they aren’t)…

    Flande’s understandable but Sanchez is a surprise, maybe the Phils already reached out to work out a minor league deal.

     
  • Posts: 0 George

    Ibanez and Baez were kept because if released, the Phils still have to pay them. Would anyone really want either of them playing for someone else (even if they’re not playing particularly well) while the Phils are paying their multi-million dollar salaries?

    Some of these decisions, too, are based on team needs and player experience. Bockock and Zagurski have ML playing time, Sanchez, on the other hand, is probably three years away. Zagurski could end up as the second bullpen lefty, and, as last year showed, injuries could very well produce the need for a reserve like Bocock.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Dipsy just wants to jettison Raul at whatever cost.

     
  • Posts: 0 Dan

    Congratulations to that Lakewood squad. They are an exciting and talented group and hopefully some of them will be bringing their winning ways to Citibank park. I read Mark Parent say that 8 or 9 of the players on that team will be major-leaguers.

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    I meant why aren’t veterans on big deals teams are trying to move unprotected in the rule 5 draft itself or are they? I get you need to free space before the draft but I’ll echo Dispy’s curiosity on that point.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    Ibanez would need to be put on waivers (nobody would claim him), and after he cleared the Phillies would still be responsible for his salary (even after he caught on with another team). This isn’t the NFL, all these deals are guaranteed. They don’t even have a rightfielder at the moment, as bad as he is I don’t see the point in releasing Ibanez and creating another vacant position. They would still be paying him.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 Marc H

    I was hoping that Jesus Sanchez would make it to the Phillies, just so there would be some tangible benefits from the Bobby Abreau trade.

     
  • Posts: 0 Marc H

    If they spot play/platoon him, I think that they can milk one more productive year from Ibanez. Plus, nice guys deserve the benefit of the doubt. After 2011, they will get some salary relief (Lidge and Ibanez).

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    The Abreu trade was painful at the time but as bad as it looks it was the

    It would have made no sense to release a guy like Ibanez but it may in theory make sense if he’s unprotected in the rule 5 draft to enable someone else to be protected. Does anyone have any information directly on that point?

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    ^The Abreu trade was painful at the time but as bad as it looks it was the first move in shedding the Wade-mediocre mentality and building a winner….

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    In re Ibanez:

    “As bad as he is” ???

    I grant you, he’s not the greatest player on the planet….But he DID carry the Phillies the first half of ’09 and almost carried him the second half of ’10. When guys like Rollins, Utley, Howard and Vic were either on the DL or scuffling…..Raul stepped up in a big way. He’s a MAJOR reason that we went on that late-season tear.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    ^ almost carried THEM the second half of ’10

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    Marc H- it’s not just Ibaenz and Lidge, it’s Rollins, Madson, Gload, Schneider, Baez all with their contracts up at the end of this year.

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    To me the only issue with Ibanez is because he’s not really someone we can put behind Howard there’s a problem unless a RH RBI bat can be put in RF. Ibanez does deserve more credit than he’s given.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    I think they should pretty much platoon in both LF and RF. I’d also rest Utley, Rollins, and Polanco three games a month (at a minimum). There would be a lot of benefits to making those guys 145 game players (which will pay off in September/October). Dusty Baker really got a good year out of a 35 year old Scott Rolen by resting him on day games after night games or on the day before/after an off day.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    Chuck – Ibanez is no longer a good player. Sorry. He did not “carry” them in the second half. He simply played better than he did in the first half. There’s a big difference.

    If he was placed on waivers, no team would be foolish enough to claim him. That’s reality.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Again…over the last 70 games of 2010…..while a good chunk of the starting lineup was either struggling, on the DL, just coming off the DL and finding his swing again…

    ….Raul Ibanez hit .309 with 9 HR and 44 RBI. From the first 85 games to the second 70 games his OBP jumped almost 50 points, SLG almost 100 points, and OPS more than 150 points.

    So you’re telling me that he produces those numbers while a lot of his teammates are hurt or slumping….and that’s not carrying the team??

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    I agree 1000% that Ibanez carried us early in ’09, and late in ’10 . . . people want to complain about the contract that he’s making $11 M a year.. but still the truth is, if Ruben didn’t make such a strong 3-year-deal . . we would’ve been left with Milton Bradley, etc… as our only option

    People make too much of a big deal of a Left Fielder that bats 6th . . . and not enough of a big deal about a Secondbaseman that bats 3rd

    Ibanez, despite not winning the MVP, has been a very good addition to this ballclub and helped them win a lot of games

    Also, I was glad to read all of NJ’s Abreu post, because at first I thought it was the same old “we got nothing in return” … but he realizes that we didn’t trade him to get prospects, we traded him to save some salary, and to get rid of the players that would rather get a walk than a hit with the game on the line

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    No team would take Ibanez right now … but midseason, when teams need a Left handed bat, a Leftfielder, or a DH . . . . a veteran guy that won’t disrupt the clubhouse, has some playoff experience, etc .

    Teams will definitely take Ibanez, but right now there are so many other options that they can sign to THEIR terms

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    He can’t field, he can’t run, and I’m definitely not excited by 44 RBIs in the second half. If he would have made a fairly easy play in the first game of the NLCS, that series may have turned out much different.

    His WAR was last year was 1.0, which roughly equates to a bench player. That’s actually what he should be at this stage of his career.

    I’m sure he’s a great guy…he’s just not a good player anymore.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    Ibanez has been a good soldier but the Phillies are left with very little line-up flexibility behind Howard which is clearly the issue trying to be addressed. It really isn’t a case of hang it on Raul and all will be OK, he pretty much reached what should have been his expected numbers last year and others didn’t.

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    @Don M – As you may recall, Ibanez was signed at the beginning of that years free agent season. As things played out, had Ruben waited another month, he would have had his pick of good, cheap outfielders to put out in left. Ruben misread the market.

    My understanding is is that if you don’t protect a guy on your 40 man, that just makes other teams eligible to pick him up. Its not the same as putting him on waivers and being liable for his contract. @Chuck – He has a great first half of ’09. he did not carry us the second half of last year. He was much improved, though. That said, I don’t want a guy, especially for 11.5m, who takes 80 games off a year. I don’t hate Raul. I would love him for 4m. I do hate that he is our starting LFer though.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    Via Twitter:

    ToddZolecki: Francoeur close to signing with Royals, says @Ken_Rosenthal. Phillies never seriously pursued him.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    So, Francoeur & Diaz are now off the board. It will be interesting to see what RAJ is planning.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    44 RBI over 70 games. That equates to 102 over a 162 season. Raul was still recovering from his injury in ’09. That’s a major reason why his numbers were down for the second half of ’09 and the first half of ’10.

    I’ll take 102 RBI from my left fielder ANY DAY OF THE WEEK.

    As for the contract….that’s what it took to sign him before 2009. At least one onther team…the Angels were ready to sign him for basically the same money and for 3 years.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    And a good point was made. If Ruben would have waited there’s a good possibility we would have had someone like Milton Bradley and all his sh*t.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Without Raul Ibanez, the Phillies never make the World Series in 2009 . . . because they wouldn’t have been in contention at the deadline, wouldn’t have aquired Lee, etc..

    Which stud OFs did the Phillies pass on to ensure they got Ibanez: Milton Bradley, Pat Burrell, Garrett Anderson (who the Braves got stuck with)

    Amaro did what he had to do to get the best available OF… ideally he wouldn’t have had to offer that 3rd year, but somebody would have, so I’m glad that Amaro got him, since its helped us to two more NL EAST titles, and deep postseason runs

     
  • Posts: 0 Geoff

    Well..bring in another cheap lefty and stockpile them.

    Now…both Diaz & Franceour gone means we LET them go, meaning RAJ has something planned.

     
  • Posts: 0 George

    Players with as many years in ML as Ibanez can’t just be left off the roster. I’m sure he’s out of options, so the only thing a team could do is put him on waivers.
    Ibanez, given his salary, wouldn’t be claimed, and would become a free agent. Given his ability, another team would then pick him up for close to the ML minimum, and the Phils would have to make up the difference between that minimum and the $11 million he was originally signed for. Would anyone really want Raul to get a key hit against the Phils when the Phils are the ones paying him?

     
  • Posts: 0 Bebin

    I think we can all agree that he’s not going anywhere…Raul is staying with us for the year but I would rather him hit 7th rather than 5th. And I wouldn’t mind getting a line of 75 runs, 16 hrs, 83 rbis and .275 avg from a person batting 7th…As for the defense thats when you plug in a player like Ben francisco in the late innings like we did for burell

    the lineup as I see it now

    1 CF Victorino
    2 3B Polanco
    3 2B Utley
    4 1B Howard
    5 RF
    6 SS Rollins
    7 LF Ibanez
    8 C Ruiz
    9 P

    Now what the Phillies need to do is find a right handed bat to protect howard for this their going to have to pony up some money. I don’t really give a crap about what dave montgomery has to say if he wants to win pony up some money bastard ,160 million isn’t that bad since your already raising our ticket prices every friggin yr. So once he does that I think we should either opt for a trade to get Carlos Quentin or sign Magglio Ordonez and the worst case scenario is Jeff francouer or Jermaine Dye

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Or maybe he has nothing planned except for a platoon of Brown/Francisco and Raul/Francisco.

    Do we really want Juan Rivera and his lousy defense???

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Amaro’s plan is probably let Ben Francisco be the guy…

    and unless they sign someone who is clearly better (Magglio), then I’m not concerned at all that Diaz and possibly Francoeur sign somewhere else

     
  • Posts: 0 psujoe

    Ibanez had a very good second half. He needs to be pltooned a little more this year. I wouldn’t just give him away for nothing.

    How can BenFran platoon for Brown and Raul at the same time?

     
  • Posts: 0 The Dipsy

    There is no way that Amaro is going to start the season with Francisco in RF. He’s gonna make the deal to bring in the RF bat. Are you guys seriously questioning that? He always plays it close to the vest before he “springs his trap”. I think we can all agree that 11.5m would have been better spent somewhere else.

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 0 George

    Carlos Quentin can’t hit left handers, so I hope he ISN’T traded for. Ordonez would involve a bidding war, because several teams want him. He’s not special enough (or young enough) to stretch the budget for. Jermaine Dye at this stage of his career is no better than Francisco, and Francoeur already signed with KC.

    As far as ticket prices increasing, name me one thing that hasn’t increased. Team costs go up sometimes even without an increase in the player’s payroll.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    The Dipsy . . . Who would you have chosen to play LF the past two seasons if you don’t like Ibanez on the roster???

    And say it was either Ibanez for 3 years, or no years .. since he would’ve signed somewhere else

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    I’m not gonna comment anymore on the 11.5M. Raul helps us get to the playoff for 2 straight years. And, who’s to say that he won’t in 2011 too?? Time to just accept the fact that he’s here and cheer for him to contribute in a big way…

     
  • BEN IS GOING TO SURPRIZE SOME OF YOU GUYS THIS YEAR……….

     
  • Posts: 0 George

    Yes, the $11.5 million could have been better spent. $10 million could have gone to Ben Sheets, and the remainder could have been used to sign Chen Ming Wang.

    Everybody misspends once in a while (heck, Gillick paid $20+ millions for Adam Eaton!) I think maybe Amaro overpaid a little, but not by anything even close to those aforementioned players. And Ibanez could still have one good year left.

    Dipsy, I think you tend to look at the contracts other teams just got lucky
    with (Burrell with the Giants comes to mind) when you attempt to determine a player’s worth.

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from waldorf

    There is always the Beltran option. He can play 7 possitions at a gold glove level and the Mets will pay part of the contract. Thats what great teams do.

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from waldorf

    Guys
    You cant cry about contracts then get offended when people call out 0 RBI.
    Its the king of all contracts.

     
  • Posts: 0 Ted Bell

    Don & Chuck – Just because I think Ibanez is no longer a good player, does not mean that I don’t want him to succeed in a Phillies uniform. I HOPE he wins the triple crown, but I’m very realistic in what I EXPECT from a 39 year old player with little range or speed.

    This mantra that Ibanez helped them make the playoffs in 2009 & 2010 is overstated, also. Other than the first two months of 2009, he was an average offensive player. Since June 1 of 2009 he’s hit .260. That would be fine if he brought other skills to the table, I guess. We can blame injuries, but at the same time we must accept that older players get injured more often and take longer to recover. It’s not Raul’s fault, it’s just a fact.

    I’m Ted Bell.

     
  • Posts: 0 NJ

    What is this whole talk about the possibility of waiving Ibanez? Not even a remote possibility and the question started was about the rule 5 draft and player protection and why teams leave veterans who 99% won’t be claimed like Ibanez protected, or don’t they…

    If Francour signs with the Royals you can be sure it’s for a big chunk more cash than we would have given since the Royals have had a woody for him for years.

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Yeah, what exactly did Pat Burrell do in the postseason this year? How about 6 for 42. Oh, and by the way 0 RBI in the WS. (Andrew from W, you got that??)

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from waldorf

    I believe he won a world series?
    Thats his second BTW

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Ted, so Other than 33% of 2009, (when he was being discussed as the MVP of the league… and was the best player on our team) … he only average the rest of the year


    I never said that anyone does or doesn’t want Ibanez to do well… but I think people are morons if they still insist Amaro overpaid for him, and should’ve/could’ve signed someone better in LF ??? That player didn’t exist, and so Amaro paid what he needed to, to get the player he coveted.

    And that player has helped us

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Andrew, what place are your Mets going to finish in this year, 4th? or do you think they can make it all the way to 3rd??

     
  • Posts: 0 Chuck

    Ted, forget his age for a minute. HE GOT HURT. Plain and simple. That’s why his second half ’09 and first half ’10 was sub-par. That’s not an excuse. It’s just a fact.

     
 
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