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Phillies Acquire Hunter Pence

Posted by Corey Seidman, Fri, July 29, 2011 09:24 PM | Comments: 124
Trades

Hunter Pence is a Phillie. And it did not cost Domonic Brown.

The Phillies have traded Jarred Cosart, Jonathan Singleton, Josh Zeid (Double-A reliever) and a player to be named later to Houston for Pence. The player to be named later is not believed to be a top-tier prospect, and the Astros are also including $1MM in the deal.

In Pence, the Phillies get the righthanded fifth batter they wanted so badly. He is under team control for all of next season and the season after. Those are his final arbitration years, and based on his $6.9MM salary this season, an estimate of $23MM over the next two seems fair. Though, Ruben Amaro could do as he usually does and reach a contract extension instead.

Click the link for reaction and analysis.Cosart was the Phillies top pitching prospect. Singleton was their best hitting prospect. This is a hefty price. But neither was going to be a part of the 2011 Phillies, or the 2012 Phillies, or the 2013 Phillies, or probably the 2014 Phillies.

Each is a Single-A prospect with a very big buzz. Cosart’s buzz has been generated more by the Phillies’ PR machine and his performance in the Futures Game in Arizona than by his recent outings for Clearwater. On the year, he has a 4.18 ERA, 1.30 WHIP, and 6.7 strikeout-per-nine rate. The fastball may be electric, but as of now the numbers are not. There is a good chance that Cosart’s value may never be higher than it was these past few weeks, and in that case, kudos to Ruben Amaro for selling high as he did with the eerily similar Jason Knapp.

Singleton is a bit harder to lose, but keep in mind that he is a man without a position … at least in this organization. He failed in left field the same way a blocked Ryan Howard did when Jim Thome played first base once upon a time. Singleton is a patient hitter with power that is a few years younger than his competition. I won’t lie to you and say he won’t be an impact player some day for Houston, because I strongly believe he will.

But you have to give something to get something. We’ve been spoiled by Ruben Amaro’s fleecings in recent years. But in this case, Houston was under no immediate obligation to deal Pence. They could have shopped him this winter or next trade deadline and still gotten a decent return. The Phillies had no leverage here.

But Amaro did what he thought he needed to do and what his manager wanted him to do – went out and acquired one of the top available bats. Pence undoubtedly makes the Phillies a better team, the question is only “by how much?” The answer depends entirely on the Phillies’ outfield arrangement. If Brown rides the pine every day, Pence’s addition adds marginal value, maybe a win or so. But if Brown shifts to left and Ibanez sits, Pence increases the Phillies offensively, defensively and on the basepaths. He is sneakily fast, I’ve always likened his speed to Chase Utley‘s. He runs incredibly hard and beats out balls he shouldn’t.

To most, this looks like a bad trade, like an overpay. But keep in mind that the process employed by each team is different. For a team with a World Series window of three or four years, Pence is probably more valuable than Cosart and Singleton. Even if you don’t believe that, you will once you see him in red pinstripes.

Avatar of Corey Seidman

About Corey Seidman

Corey Seidman has written 210 articles on Phillies Nation.

Corey is Analysis Editor for Phillies Nation and also writes for CSNPhilly.com.

 
 
  • Posts: 0 toddfromfairmount

    RAJ does it again. D Brown, we love you.

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Any chance Howard will be one of the PTBNL?

    Love the deal

    Brown to left Raul meet the bench

     
    • Posts: 5152 Lefty

      Avatar of Lefty

      LOL

       
    • Posts: 971 betasigmadeltashag

      Avatar of betasigmadeltashag

      I am sorry but am I the only one who has watched Dom
      Brown play he is not major league ready, Raul is the left fielder with the occosional platoon against lefties especially on the road with JMJ. Dom Brown to AAA to keep getting AB’ hopefully with lower hands, back up in Sept. he needs it. Dom Brown needs to work on playing defense and move his hands down and get the loop out of his swing. 2012 might be his year in LF I hope he fulfills his potential. But it is not this year

       
      • Posts: 0 Nicole

        I agree with you completely; although, I was so sad to hear him talk last night. I think that Mayberry is having a better year than Dom Brown. I think he needs time to grow. I read here that Dom is patient at the plate, but I have not seen that. Last week I thought he was swinging worse than Ryan Howard, and he’s definitely not ready for right field–he needs practice there.

         
  • Posts: 5152 Lefty

    Avatar of Lefty

    Now that’s a little less than what JW got isn’t it?

     
  • Posts: 0 Mazinman

    Assuming the two players are the mid to low level prospect I expect them to be then my hat is off to Ruben Amaro. I can’t wait to see Pence in right tomorrow!

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Im guessing he bats second.

    Can he play first base?

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    so much for that “Ruin Tomorrow Jr.” nickname that some nerd tried to label him with since he took over the GM spot

     
    • Posts: 5152 Lefty

      Avatar of Lefty

      LOL- I really like self effacing humor

       
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Its a deal it had to be made.
    The mets dealing Beltout to SF and the 2 games before tonight mad it abundantly clear.

    There will be another deal coming.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    “V.I.P” is the Nickname for the Outfield according to Nick L, via 97.5 and crossing broad…. gotta think its gonna stick and they’re printing the shirts already

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Lets get that RP from Baltimore… the dude that Corey loves.. him for Rizzotti and ? …

     
  • Posts: 5152 Lefty

    Avatar of Lefty

    The next deal is with San Diego according to reports, I hope it’s Adams, not Bell.

     
    • Posts: 0 TRADEHOWARDNOW

      THIS TRADE IS SO DUMB. HOW MANY STRIKEOUTS VERSUS GOOD PITCHING ARE WE GOING TO SEE IN OCTOBER. OH LOOK THERE’S HOWARD STRIKING OUT AGAIN. OH LOOK THERE’S PENCE STRIKING OUT AGAIN. REMEMBER WHEN ALFONSO SORIANO WAS A STRIKEOUT MACHINE ON THE NYY AND IT RAN HIM OUT OF TOWN IN NYC. HEY HOPE IT HAPPENS TO HOWARD. WE SHOULD TRADE HOWARD TO SEATTLE FOR FELIX THEY NEED HITTING AND OSWALT NEEDS A CHIROPRACTOR. THEN WE CAN TRADE FOR ADAM DUNN AT 1B. HE’LL COME CHEAP AND HE CAN DO 85% OF WHAT HOWARD DOES IN PHILLY GUARANTEED

       
      • Posts: 0 Usso

        anyone who speaks in all caps should be ignored.

         
  • Posts: 0 bart shart

    Maybe one of the other two prospects is Andrew Carpenter? He impresses me NOT !!!

     
  • Posts: 0 Manny

    Buying really high… Pence isn’t THIS good. And we’re giving up our top 2 minor league prospects PLUS two more players. I’m excited about seeing Pence in the lineup, don’t get me wrong, but we overpaid substantially… If one of those unnamed players turns out to be Valle/may/one of the baby aces, then we got screwed big time.

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    Stros sending cash. Wow great job. I said trust jr. Pence pulled and getting hugs. Oh baby

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Would like to get a leftie
    But I guess SF and ATL have them all already

    Everyone here agrees you bench Raul and move Brown to left?
    I hope

    Hes an athlete he can play left and he cannot be worse than Ibanez thats imposible

     
    • Posts: 971 betasigmadeltashag

      Avatar of betasigmadeltashag

      I am really getting tired of the Raul hate on this blog, and the love affair with a guy who is probably worse in the outfield then Raul, just because he is fasterdoes not make him a better defender, I have never seen a guy get more hits that should be errors then Brown. Raul can hit still dispite what all you negative people on here. Pence to Right Brown to AAA is ;not AA to learn how to play defense. Raul and JMJ in left especially against lefties on the road. Andrew you are an idiot

       
      • Posts: 0 Nicole

        Again I agree completely with you. You just can not trade the hustle and leadership of Raul for Brown. Brown is not ready in the field–doesn’t track the ball well and from what I have seen his arm is about the same as Raul’s. Raul’s might be weaker but Brown rarely throws on a straight path so is useless right now.

        I think you switch Raul and Mayberry too depending on the pitching and to start to get Mayberry extremely comfortable in left. But Raul is hitting a lot of RBI’s right now that Brown is definitely not going to be able to do.

         
  • Posts: 0 bart shart

    I think Pence will bat fifth. When Placido returns, the batting order will probably be this:
    Rollins
    Polanco
    Utley
    Howard
    Pence
    Victorino
    Ibanez
    Ruiz

    Looks pretty good on paper

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Adams is nasty… but they want to keep him.. I’d take Bell too, the only other team really looking at him was Texas, since Neftali Feliz isn’t quite himself

    ……
    I know im a huge homer sometimes.. .but how can you complain about a single move this organization has done in the past 5 years

     
  • Posts: 0 TRADEHOWARDNOW

    THIS TRADE IS SO DUMB. HOW MANY STRIKEOUTS VERSUS GOOD PITCHING ARE WE GOING TO SEE IN OCTOBER. OH LOOK THERE’S HOWARD STRIKING OUT AGAIN. OH LOOK THERE’S PENCE STRIKING OUT AGAIN. REMEMBER WHEN ALFONSO SORIANO WAS A STRIKEOUT MACHINE ON THE NYY AND IT RAN HIM OUT OF TOWN IN NYC. HEY HOPE IT HAPPENS TO HOWARD. WE SHOULD TRADE HOWARD TO SEATTLE FOR FELIX THEY NEED HITTING AND OSWALT NEEDS A CHIROPRACTOR. THEN WE CAN TRADE FOR ADAM DUNN AT 1B. HE’LL COME CHEAP AND HE CAN DO 85% OF WHAT HOWARD DOES IN PHILLY GUARANTEED

     
  • Posts: 2990 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    “Raul meet the bench” Except that he’ll still get his fair share of playing time.

     
    • Posts: 0 EricL

      More like “Brown meet the bench.”

      Raul is one of Chollie’s guys, and he’s not so hot on Dom, so, you know, the better player will end up sitting.

       
      • Posts: 971 betasigmadeltashag

        Avatar of betasigmadeltashag

        Out side of being faster in what world is Dom better right now than Raul, AVG? Power? routes to fly balls, Raul can not get to as many balls but he knows when to let a singledrop and turn it into a triple. Get your head out of your u know what, and get off the love feast for Dom he really has done nothing

         
  • Posts: 276 Jeff of Nova

    Avatar of Jeff of Nova

    Great pick up, but only because they did not give up Brown or Worley.

    For all you who were saying that we should send everyone and everything for this guy, I must reiterate that you are crazy. Some of the trade ideas some of you had last night…. Cossart, Singleton, Worley and Brown for him are crazy. That is more than we sent for Halladay and Pence is not Halladay.

    So as I said before glad RAJ made a deal not using Worley and Brown and got a guy we can control more than this year. Great job to RAJ. Pence is a good addition he is not the answer… the answer is Utley to continue hitting, Howard to be more consistent, Polanco back and healthy.

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Raul should play maybe vs righties at home and in washington

    thats it

    Maybe they can deal him somewhere with the phils picking up most his salary as a courtesy

     
    • Posts: 2990 Chuck A.

      Avatar of Chuck A.

      So what happens now?? Roster move has to be made.

       
  • Posts: 0 Bob myers

    Glad we get to see Brown develop, and anxious to welcome Hunter Pence. Should be batting 5th behind Howard and this will help Howard out!

     
  • Posts: 0 TRADEHOWARDNOW

    PENCE AND HOWARD IN THE SAME LINEUP!!! WOW JUST SPOT PLAY THE PHILLIES ANYTIME YOU NEED K’S IN FANTASY.

     
  • Posts: 0 Mazinman

    Houston even sending us some money to help cover the cost of Pence. Bless you Ed Wade…

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Jeff its a goofy blog.
    Try to have fun with it.

    When/if the phils lose in the playoffs Ill cry for real for a week

    Otherwise jsut have fun.

    Its a good deal.

    I suppose JMJ will get sent down again

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    If you arent going to play brown

    Then trade him.

    No point benching a young player its dumb

    If hes getting benched trade him

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    Manny you are a tool. Pence is a real deal. Now shut up and go play in the basement. Tool

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    Pence .308 batting solid guy. You guys killing this are tools. Ricky bo says a great deal.

     
  • Posts: 276 Jeff of Nova

    Avatar of Jeff of Nova

    We all need to remember this fact when you want to be all pissed about Brown.

    He is 23 and his first years stats are better than Utley when he came up and he was 25

    He needs to develop I agree with Andrew they need to keep playing him and sit Ibanez. He is done after this year.

    Pence should hit 5th when Plly comes back this weekend.

     
  • Posts: 0 TRADEHOWARDNOW

    look at the numbers. bad deal. pence is zeile on wheels. regular season – yes he’s good but he won’t hold up versus real pitching.

     
  • Posts: 0 bart shart

    I think that Ben Francisco will be either traded or cut with the addition of Pence. Just my guess.

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Wow
    RAJ hinting they may send brown down?

    I hate that

    Play him in left. Already

     
  • Posts: 0 Mazinman

    Brown should be sent down. Charlie will keep playing Ibanez in left which I am fine with and Brown will need his at bats. Let him go down and get some playing time then bring him back up in September.

     
    • Posts: 971 betasigmadeltashag

      Avatar of betasigmadeltashag

      Finally a voice of reason comes from the darkness, Brown is sent down to keep gettng ABs and next year will be in LF

       
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    there is only one philly who pisses me off
    He plays first base.

    If you arent going to PLAY BROWN
    TRADE HIM

    his value is highest now

     
  • Posts: 5152 Lefty

    Avatar of Lefty

    Maybe they are trading him. Maybe they are doing this for the San Diego trade?

     
  • Avatar of The Original Chuck P

    That’s how you do it… Singleton couldn’t play the OF- tried and failed so he was never going to play here. Cosart is a loss BUT we have tremendous pitching so its expensable and i think I’d rather have May. Hopefully one of the other young guns will pan out (Biddle). All in all, we solved a major problem next year and kept Brown and Worley. Well done.

     
  • Posts: 0 Mazinman

    I really doubt the Phillies will pull out another trade since Lidge has been pretty solid since he came back. Then again, Ruben is the master of surprise.

     
  • Avatar of The Original Chuck P

    Keep brown around for the playoff run and give him the reigns next year. Beautiful night, boys!

     
  • Posts: 530 Bruce

    Avatar of Bruce

    Is there some kind of award for the General Manager..such as GM of the year? Amaro would win in a landslide if votes were only counted here (smile). Sure, it’s a heavy price to pay in sacrificing Phillies’ two top prospects plus two additional prospects. However, as been mentioned often here, ‘the future is now’ as the current makeup of the team has a “.. World Series window of three or four years”.

    And we didn’t lose Brown or Worley. That is most gratifying for me. As for Brown, I now can’t see him riding the bench. He is most likely will go back to AAA minor league team for more seasoning and experience and will be call up on September 1st when the roster expands to 40.

    Pence will likely bat fifth against LH pitching to protect Howard. Of course, Manuel has options against RH pitching. Victorino is having great success hitting in the number 5 spot (.304 BA) and I would keep him there against RH pitching and Pence hitting lower. It will be most interesting to see how this plays out if Manuel decides to go this route.

    It’s going to be a lot of fun for the Phillies fans these next two months. And more good news; another good RH bat and a top quality pitcher is coming to the Phillies next week. Polanco and Oswalt (smile).

     
  • Posts: 0 Shane Teklits

    Is he going to be in the lineup for tomorrows game vs. Pittsburgh?

     
  • Posts: 0 dylan

    anyone who says trade howard get out of here

     
  • Posts: 2069 Brooks

    Avatar of Brooks

    I would really be interested to hear from the Brown fans exactly what he has done so far to warrant such high praise. Please dont say he has not gotten playing time. Brown has had major major opportunities to bring it home, lock it up and has not come through.

    Give up on Brown? No, continue the blind faith in him? No, platoon him – I’m OK with that.

     
  • Posts: 0 tflynn

    maybe dom brown can see a fly ball better in LF

     
  • Posts: 43 Greg

    Avatar of Greg

    Brooks, maybe the 25 BB’s to 32 SO’s he has. That’s absolutely incredible, ESPECIALLY for a Rookie. A 23 year old Rookie, too. His defense has been horrible so far, but so was Saint Utley’s for the first 2-3 years he was in the Majors.

    You must also be forgetting that he had major wrist surgery on his hamate bone, a surgery that tends to sap players of their power for a good 6 months, yet he’s still managing a near .400 slugging percentage. Oh, a .220 BABIP (Batting Average on Balls in Play) isn’t exactly helping him, either. Bump that up to .290-.310 (league average), and he’d be batting somewhere around the .275 mark with a near .400 OBP, if his BB:SO rate keeps up, (And considering his great eye at the plate, and nice job of taking a lot of Pitchers per plate appearance, I think it will).

    All that being said, I think Brown needs to go to Triple-A, but mainly just to learn a new position, Left Field. I’m incredibly excited to see an outfield of Brown, Victorino, Pence next year. Defensively, it’ll be above-average, and all three guys are athletic, not to mention each one has quite a bit of power.

     
    • Posts: 971 betasigmadeltashag

      Avatar of betasigmadeltashag

      again another voice of reason form the other side, I know I come across and not liking Brown, but I do I think if he listens and works on things he needs to he will become an above average hitter and ball player, and his plate disapline is really good. I will say the one thing that is different now then when Uttley was leaning at the major league level is the Phillies were not a playoff team with WS asperations so you can afford to let some players go through growing pains in the bigs, unforturnatly for Brown this is a WS team and can not give the time to learn on the fly. I do think he will be a five tool guy and in 2012 Brown will be a full time lf in philly

       
  • Posts: 0 Adrian M.

    At least Shane doesn’t have to bat fifth anymore. I’m sure he loved that…

     
  • Posts: 0 Ryan H.

    well you’s got your wish and we got pence. relatively cheap too. so I’m thankful for that. even though I think Brown is better than Pence RIGHT NOW. but whatever. Pence is a nice player. we’re still the favorite here. brown will be back in september and will be on the playoff roster as well. atleast he’ll be playing every day in AAA. he’s also pretty much guaranteed to be the starting LFer next year.

     
  • Posts: 2069 Brooks

    Avatar of Brooks

    I dont want to make it seem like I’m tossing D Brown under the bus. His ability excites me but, his biggest consistency has been his lack of production in key situations. Phils have really set the table for D in quite a few games.

    I dont know how much more he can learn back down the farm but continuing to play regularly, perhaps he will find the groove that got us all looking forward.

    As for Pence, he has been a regular and is in his 5th year. An AS twice, led the league in OF assist twice, has been pretty consistent with his power numbers in Houston’s Grand Canyon (what will that translate to our park?) and his average is improving as well. I just dont see a down side to this kid… but, as true Phily fans I’m sure we’ll lspot somthin’

     
    • Posts: 0 Ryan H.

      grand canyon? houston is the bandbox of all bandboxes. especially for righties.

       
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    If they send Brown down I will be pissed. Whats the point in all that?

    To me this is simple. Move brown to left. Since Pence will be here this year and 2 more Brown needs to play LF anyway.

    Center field at houston is the longest in baseball
    But yes its a nice place for righties to hit.

    I expecte pences numbers to increase going from the worst team in baseball to the best means something.

    On a side note went with my friend to claim a horse at harrahschester a month ago for $30,000

    Horses name is Pence Hanover.
    Dont bet him this week though in over his head.

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff

    @Ryan h. You have no Idea. Pence hit for over .300. He will hit 20 to 25 homers. 20 doubles. Come see when brown hits .260. Pence is also a much better d. You have no idea what type of guy we are getting. Rail needs to play as well. Send brown down.

     
  • Posts: 2 Patriot2

    Avatar of Patriot2

    Another fantastic move by RAJ. The post suggesting Pence to hit 5th against lefties and 6th against righties fails to recognize that Pence is hitting about 340 against righties and hits .280 against lefties. So what you have in Pence is somewhat what you have with Ibanez in that both hit well no matter what side the pitcher comes from.

    So if I were managing this team, I would bat Pence in the cleanup spot and move Howard to 5th in the lineup no mater who starts for the opponent. Howard ends to many rallies while Pence can drive in some runs and get on base for Howard. Also, they need to break up the 2 lefties in a row situation forcing the opponents to change relievers more often.

    Finally, I want Ibanez to finish this season in Left field as he is the guy you want in the lineup when the chips are down as we head into the post season. He seems to be out of his early season funk as a hitter. Send Brown to Lehigh Valley to finish the season there in left field and get ready for next year when Ibanez is gone.

     
  • Posts: 0 TheDipsy

    Great deal. Pence goes to RF, Brown and Mayberry platoon in LF. Awesome. @Patriot – Is your last name Ibanez? He might be released but I doubt it. He won’t be on the post season roster. What this trade is gonna due for the Phils is immeasurable. Sure hate giving up Zeid, though. Baaaahhhhh.

    The Dipsy

     
    • Posts: 971 betasigmadeltashag

      Avatar of betasigmadeltashag

      Really dipsy, more like Raul JMJ in left. You really must be high if you think Raul will not be on the playoff rooster, he is going to be the every day lf for the rest of 2011, Brown will be send down to see if he can play lf better then he can play RF.

       
      • Posts: 24 georgie

        Avatar of

        Dips…..you did not just say that! Raul won’t be on the post-season roster? You can’t be serious….you actually believe Charlie would drop Raul from the roster for the playoffs??? It will NEVER happen, unless he gets injured.

         
 
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