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Phillies Drop Fifth Straight Game

Posted by Ryan Dinger, Wed, June 06, 2012 10:48 PM | Comments: 148
2012 Game Recaps, Analysis, News, Opinion, Posts

Hunter Pence and the Phillies seem to have run into a wall during their current five-game losing streak. PHOTO: AP

The misery of Phillies fans everywhere continued tonight as the Dodgers managed to win another close game against the Phillies by a score of 6-5. The loss would be the Phillies fifth in a row, dropping them two games below .500. Coupled with a Nationals win, the loss puts the Phillies six games out of first place, eight back in the loss column.

KENDRICK DOESN’T ANSWER THE CALL:

- Kyle Kendrick had pitched well lately, and the Phillies needed him to step up and stop  a losing streak tonight. He withered like a flower without water in the face of the challenge.

- After getting through the first two innings pretty easily, Kendrick got hurt in the third by a single, an RBI triple,  and a John Mayberry error. The sequence would yield two Dodgers runs and give them the lead. Kendrick would follow that up by working himself into a one-out, bases loaded jam. To his credit, KK worked out of it without letting up anymore runs. But it would not be the end of the Dodgers scoring.

-  In the sixth, Kendrick would be charged with three more runs, though two of them came with Raul Valdes on the mound.  It was a disappointing effort for Kendrick, as the offense twice spotted him a lead, and he twice gave it away. To have the pitcher blow the lead when the hitters are finally able to score some runs perfectly encapsulates the season so far. When the pitching is going well, the bats are silent, and vice versa.

OFFENSE DOESN’T DO ENOUGH:

- The offense showed a little life tonight by scoring five runs. It wasn’t an offensive explosion, however, and the four runs would not be enough to get the win.

- Shane Victorino homered in the second inning to get the scoring started. It was the first time Victorino, who is hitting just (.152) over his last ten games, had an extra base hit since doubling on May 26 against the Cardinals. He would drive another ball well in the ninth, but Tony Gwynn was able to get under it.

- Jimmy Rollins gave the Phillies the lead, 4-2, in the fifth inning when he followed up Ty Wigginton‘s solo home run with a two-run shot of his own. The home run was Rollins’s third of the season. After slumping through the first two months of the season, Rollins has started June off on a bit of a hot streak. He’s hitting .308 (8-for-28), with a home run, two triples, and a double since June 1st. After hitting .239 through the first two months of the season, a hot Rollins would be a huge shot in the arm for the offense. Throughout his career, Rollins has had a tendency to start slowly before picking it up in June, and his 2012 splits are currently all well below his career averages. There’s reason to believe he can be better than he has been. At this point, when you’re clinging to any glimmer of hope you can find, Rollins could provide reason to be optimistic.

LATE-INNING STRUGGLES:

- The struggles the Phillies have had coming up big late in games have been well-documented. They’re now 0-22 in games in which they trailed after the seventh inning. For the third time this series, the Phillies failed to score a run after the fifth inning. These game stories are getting easier to write because I can pretty much assume the Phils won’t win if they’re down late. This team just doesn’t seem to have that spark, and they never have someone step up and will them to victory.

ANOTHER ONE-RUN GAME, ANOTHER LOSS:

- So far this season, the Phillies have gone 5-10 in one-run games, including losing all three of these games against the Dodgers by the slimmest of margins. During the five-year run of division titles, winning one-run games was something of a calling cards for the Phillies. From 2007-2011, the Phillies went 122-103 (.542) in one-run games. That number is even better if you don’t include 2007, when the Phils went 14-23 in one-run games. Right now, the Phillies record in one-run games is pretty much the difference between last place and fighting for first place in the division. They need to start winning some of these close ones. Good teams find ways to win close games.

INJURIES:

- Hunter Pence appeared to hurt his wrist in the third inning when he crashed into the right field wall going back on Tony Gwynn’s triple. Pence would stay in the game after some motion testing by Scott Sheridan, but it may be something to monitor.

- In the fifth inning, Freddy Galvis appeared to injure his back swinging at a pitch. Again Scott Sheridan would venture out from the dugout, and, unlike Hunter Pence, Galvis would not be able to continue. He would attempt finish out his at-bat, but after a few pitches, he was unable to continue. He was replaced in the at-bat by Mike Fontenot, who walked. After the game, it was announced that Galvis would be placed on the 15-day DL. A corresponding move will be announced tomorrow.

- More injuries is just about the last thing this Phillies team needs. You begin to wonder how much more they can endure if Galvis misses extended time, considering their already lengthy DL and the struggles of their offense this season. Chase Utley and Ryan Howard seem to be progressing, and they can’t get back fast enough.

GAME NOTES:

- The Philles five-game losing streak is their longest of the season.  They’ll look to end the streak and salvage a game from this series when they send Cole Hamels to the mound against Aaron Harang tomorrow afternoon.

Avatar of Ryan Dinger

About Ryan Dinger

Ryan Dinger has written 125 articles on Phillies Nation.

Ryan stated writing for Phillies Nation in 2012.

 
 
  • Posts: 0 Catcher

    Well…we know what the Phillies are good at….losing the lead.

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Bad enough having the number 2 pay roll in the sport and sucking.

    But I am just gonna memo Charlie and the Rube.

    Thome sucks. This is not 1995 and sending him up downa run in the 9th is basicly throwing in the towel.

    I know its a feel good story and hes one of Charlies guys.

    Ill tell you who Andrew from Waldorfs guys are.
    Guys who win games. I dont care if its Charles Manson, Ghangis Khan or OJ Simpson.

    I guess something doesnt have to give and they will say its injuries yada yada yada.

    Another memo you are old. This comes with it all.

     
    • Posts: 0 Jeff Dowder

      I’m guessing that you’ll see Thome retire on June 18.

       
      • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

        Avatar of Chuck A.

        Maybe they can drop him off in Baltimore and he can join another one that needs a walker….Jamie Moyer.

         
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      Here is a partial list of hitters who weren’t as good as Thome last year:

      Teixeira, Howard, Youkilis, Kinsler, ARod, Swisher, Zobrist, Butler, Nelson Cruz, McCutchen, McCann, Bruce, Y.Molina, etc….

      Could he have lost it over the off-season? Certainly possible, and he hasn’t done anything to disprove that so far.

      We should get a better idea over the weekend.

       
      • Posts: 0 Jeff Dowder

        Good point. The first thing I thought when the team signed Thome was how glad I was that they didn’t bring in someone like Andrew McCutchen or Jay Bruce.

         
  • Posts: 2 dcurcio25

    Avatar of dcurcio25

    This season so far IS a JOKE

     
  • Posts: 5229 Lefty

    Avatar of Lefty

    Losing sucks, it really does, very frustrating.

    And this isn’t meant to make anyone feel better, because it won’t, – but at least we are not alone.

    The National League is like bizarro world, the whole league is turned upside down.
    Last year’s playoff teams with this year’s records

    Phillies 28-30
    Milwaukee 25-31
    St Louis 28-28
    Arizona 26-30

    The first three lost key players either to injury or FA, I can’t explain the DBacks, maybe they were a mirage last year?

     
  • Posts: 0 Jeff Dowder

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Chuck you are cracking me up anymore.

    Arizona was a mirage. If the Phils had drawn DBacks Brewers Yankees last year they would have won another WS.

     
  • Posts: 522 Morris Buttermaker

    Avatar of Morris Buttermaker

    Team stinks.

     
  • Posts: 0 SavannahPhilliesPhan

    I try not to watch it when they are losing….it helps somehow. It keeps me from getting too frustrated. I wait several hours then watch the results. I stop watching the actual games when they start to get behind. I just can’t stand listening to the announcers from the other side especially. The negativity on all the blog sites is also depressing. So called phans are jumping off the band wagon in droves and of course…there are those” who told us so from the beginning” who keep telling us how they knew this would happen!!! Are they looking for someone to pat them ont the back and tell them how wonderful they are? Who cares if they thought that in ST!!!! Really who gives a sh*t what they think they knew. And I wish management would stop throwing the return of CU and RH out there constantly in order to keep fans interested. This team as it is now will not be competing in the world serier!! And the sooner we admit that the sooner we can get on with trying to improve the roster. What is the point of constantly pointing out the obvious? We are beating a dead horse. RA and the owners need to make serious changes this season. It is not the fault of the player they picked up over the winter. ….they are just not good enough to compete with the power players.

     
    • Posts: 0 Ryne Duren

      i agree!

       
  • Posts: 0 Fritz

    They STINK!

     
  • Posts: 0 TheDipsy

    What do you people expect? We don’t have the players to compete against the better teams in the league. We’re in a tight game with the Dodgers – its a big series for early in the year – its bad enough the Kendrick is starting it – but then who comes in? A guy named Raul Valdez?

    I mean – injuries should ever be used as an excuse. But……uh. How much is one team supposed to take? Now…Galvis. Look at our lineup. Its really bad.

    The Dipsy

     
    • Posts: 5229 Lefty

      Avatar of Lefty

      I know what I expect, I expect the sell out streak to end – today. I’m not saying I’m happy about it, I just think it’s going to happen.

      Go on the Phils website and check out the available tickets for today’s game. They’d have to have a hell of a last minute rush and about 6 hours left (at the time of this comment) to change that. I just checked best available in five different categories of seats, they’re available. But hey, you can get 2 for section 117- 26 rows behind the dugout, that was nearly impossible last season. And they’re only 70 bucks a pop. I wish I didn’t have to work, I’d go to see Cole.

       
      • Posts: 875 schmenkman

        Avatar of schmenkman

        Agreed, Lefty — today might be the day. Makes sense that it would be a day game when schools are still in session. The last such game, against Houston on May 15th, was their lowest attendance of the year, with 43,781 (100.3%). They were also 2 games below .500 at that point, but there was more of the “still early” sentiment then.

         
      • Posts: 0 SavannahPhilliesPhan

        Loss of revenue from not selling seats is going to spur these owners to do something!! Otherwise they will ride the money train right to the bank. I know their payroll is high now, but these budget players that they picked up in the winter are not doing it. Not their fault of course because they are being asked to do something they are not equipped to handle.

         
  • Posts: 0 Robert in NJ

    Let’s see when that sell out record gets broken this season and also when the fans start peppering the old men on the field. Charlie is a great manager but has an Achilles heal. He is too buddy-buddy with the guys.

    At this point, even if Utley and Howard had a miraculous healing this team is done for the season. Ruben it is time to deal some of these guys and rebuild. The fans would appreciate it and the sell out record may continue if we can see some excitement back on the field.

    Losing is terrible to watch but lethargy is even worse.

    R

     
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      I think you’re mistaking failure with lethargy.

       
      • Posts: 1135 EricL

        Avatar of EricL

        He’s also mistaking bodily repair (heal) with the back of one’s foot (heel).

         
  • Posts: 0 Dave

    It could be worse…it could be 1988. Now, THAT team was awful. Luis Aguayo and David Palmer anyone?

     
  • Posts: 0 TheDipsy

    Charlie is not a great manager. Charlie was a GOOD manager for the team we HAD. Now, and perhaps going forward, we will have a different team. Right now, this team exposes two of Charlie’s biggest weaknesses:

    1. Handling the pen;
    2. Running an offense that needs to manufacture runs.

    I’ll be honest, I don’t care ho much Papelbon gets “lathered up” in the bullpen. He’s not Smarty Jones. If its not save situation – don’t put him the effin game. You save him for the next day……derrrrrrrrrr.

    The Dipsy

     
    • Posts: 0 George

      With the ‘pen the Phils have right now, even Tony LaRussa would look bad managing it.

      The only proven and CONSISTENT arms out there are Papelbon and maybe Bastardo. The long man is currently in the starting rotation. Manuel has the choice right now of running the starter too long, as in the Lee game, or putting in someone like Valdez or a an inexperienced rookie like Diekman.

      The same might be said for the offense. No matter who is at the plate, they don’t seem to drive anyone in. Maybe when a guy is on first, he should try stealing the next three bases. You don’t score runs on popups and Ks.

       
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    I love Charlie. More than some of the other old guys I grew up following. Owens, Dallas Green, Weaver of the Orioles, Sparky, The White Rat Herzog, et al. BUT…. yes, his weaknesses are truly exposed. They actually were last year and the year before and so on…but a winning record has a way of hiding that or EXCUSING that.

    I’m not as critical of the pen as I am of the lineup. J-Roll should NOT be leading off. I don’t give a sh!t how much it upsets him. Whatever happened to the manager making the decisions and not worrying about pissing off a player if he’s dropped down in the order or out of the lineup altogether for that particular game??

     
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      When Rollins is hitting like last year, I have no problem with him leading off, because there are no other options who are clearly better in the leadoff spot than where they typically hit (e.g. Victorino this year, Utley or Werth in past years). Yes, maybe Pierre should bat first as long as he’s hitting well, with Rollins second, but to me that’s just rearranging deck chairs.

      I understand why Manuel stuck with him, and for the past ten games at least (when he’s been the best hitter on the team), he’s been proven right IMO.

      There will come a point (maybe next year, maybe even later this year), when Rollins shows that he can’t pull out of a slump, and then he should be dropped to ~7th.

       
    • Posts: 0 Ryne Duren

      i agree chuck 100% if you watch cholly’s manerisms and excuses after the games he just doesn’t have a clue! how do you boost a players confidence (bullpen pitchers) when you let a starter (kendrick) pitch 122 pitches cause you don’t have confidence in the pen before the 9th? How do you leave a fielding challenged fielder the night before(pierre) in the game because he was going to hit in their half of the inning? the anouncers t-bag and motor mouth were all in on that! they even covered for the brainiac manager! one of their comments was that they didn’t know if mayberry would have got to that ball! what a- holes mayberry would have not only got it, he would have had his back to the wall and just reached up and plucked it! besides we were ahead! it wasn’t like we needed baserunners at that point. he just keeps making one blunder after another that costs us games. it’s bad enough when the team doesn’t perform up to par but when the manager loses at least 5-7 games so far … well that’s more frustrating than anything. it’s a tuff year chuck!

       
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    He should be dropped to 7th NOW.

     
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      That just sounds vindictive.

       
    • Posts: 1135 EricL

      Avatar of EricL

      Since May 15th, Jimmy has an OBP of .330.
      Juan Pierre, in that same time period, has an OBP of .333

      Jimmy has more pop, is a better runner, and is getting on base at basically the same rate as Pierre. So unless you have some better option than Juan Pierre, there’s no reason to move Jimmy out of the 1-hole.

       
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Charlie is good at managing players, he is not good at managing a baseball game…..

    The best part about this losing streak is that I’m gaining some leg room on the bandwagon, which is nice

     
  • Posts: 1190 Manny

    Avatar of Manny

    These 3 games against the Dodgers were extremely frustrating… losing so many 1-run games is simply not good for the heart. It’s not that we played terrible… we’re definitely improving from what we saw from the team very early on, though.

    The NL East won’t be settled in June… or July… or August. So take a deep breath and try to enjoy the ride.

     
  • Posts: 0 TheDipsy

    Charlie was brought here to manage the three run homer. I will say that very few managers I can think of could squeeze a whole heckuva lot out of this offense. @Manny – what we’re seeing is a team that, while not terrible, has shown its weakness sooner or later, in each of these games. At lease we rotate the ways in which we lose the games – no offense, blown leads, or Blanton and Kendrick on the mound.

    The Dipsy

     
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      He’s doing a pretty good job of squeezing — the offense has been better than the pitching for a month and a half now:

      3rd in runs scored (3rd in games with 3+, 2nd in games with 4+)
      11th in runs allowed

       
  • Posts: 0 BART SHART

    Bring up Dom Brown. Send down Mayberry for some tutelege.

     
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    schmenk, how is that vindictive?? J-Roll is no longer a good leadoff hitter. Do I want him on my team?? Hell, yeah. For many reasons. But not to be the leadoff hitter anymore. Drop him in the order. Why wait?

    As for the bandwagon…yeah…it will be nice to go to games and not have to deal with people that are there only to show off the fact that they are at a Phillies game. I guess it was cool to be “seen” when they were winning but not that they are struggling it just isn’t fashionable anymore.

     
  • Posts: 1190 Manny

    Avatar of Manny

    Don’t we typically flat out suck in June?

     
  • Posts: 0 TheDipsy

    If I tell you that the team sucks right now and that I think we should trade this guy or that guy or fire this guy or that guy, while I continue to watch all the games and root for them with every fiber of my being, I would be interested to know if people would consider me ON or OFF the “bandwagon”. L’il help?

    The Dipsy

     
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    Dipsy, I would define that as ON. It’s the people that only watch when they are doing well and then bitch and complain… or don’t care at all… when they aren’t that are considered bandwagon jumpers. At least that’s my take.

     
  • Posts: 0 BART SHART

    You can be negative and frustrated and still be ON the bandwagon. After over 50 years of rooting for my Phils, I have been negative many times, even when they were winning. I guess it is a part of being passionate and needing to blow off some steam. If I did not have the Phils to focus on, and piss me off and elate me, then I might take these pent up emotions out on my loved ones. Being a fan does have some positives, I guess

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    That wasn’t directed at you, Dip …. but since you brought it up

    I think it’s hard for people to understand how people that –
    “root for a team with every fiber of their being” —- would talk about how bad they suck right now, and say how everyone within the organization should be fired/traded…

    I know that you are not a bandwagon fan – you’ve been around on this site longer than I …….. but the general fan that treats every win or loss as the definitive monent of this season drive me up a wall . . . . . who says the Phillies can’t have a month like the Marlins just did in May? To me, the season isn’t over til its over
    ……….
    There was a caller on 97.5 yesterday complaining that Pence didn’t bunt, with a runner on 2nd base – to move him over . . . . . . that is a “Phillies fan” nowadays … people that don’t know d!ck about baseball – Eagles fans that started paying attention to this team literally in 2006-2007 ….. we need them for the payroll/ sellouts, etc . . . but they sure are frustrating to listen to.

    I can’t blame Ruben Amaro for improving (on paper) a team that won 102 games last year … the same way that Charlie only gets so much blame for the struggle of the players ….

    I think Victorino should be traded at the deadline – that’s the only move I would make to this roster.. If they don’t resign Hamels there will be hell to pay – but I think to have any chance at a postseason run, they need to make sure the 1-2-3 Ace Staff is ready to go. I’ll take 1-0, 2-1 wins in the playoffs if that’s what it takes

     
    • Posts: 1190 Manny

      Avatar of Manny

      I agree on all counts.

       
      • Posts: 1190 Manny

        Avatar of Manny

        Except for trading Victorino… unless Howard, Utley, Pence, Polanco, Jimmy suddenly prove that they’re back and can carry the offense. Shane was our best offensive player last year… and we’re having trouble scoring runs more often than not…

         
      • Posts: 875 schmenkman

        Avatar of schmenkman

        (since April 23rd: 2nd in the NL in games with 4 or more)

         
      • Posts: 1190 Manny

        Avatar of Manny

        schmenk, seems like a little nitpicking. Why April 23rd? And why is it worthwhile to highlight only games with 4 or more runs?

         
      • Posts: 875 schmenkman

        Avatar of schmenkman

        The 23rd is simply when the started hitting better. I was reacting to the “having trouble scoring runs more often than not” — 4+ to me would qualify as not having trouble, which is why I picked that. They’re also 3rd in the NL in that time in games with 3 or more.

         
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Basically – I think its pretty obvious that anyone that devotes a lot of time and attention to this team/organization . . . . is a pretty damn devoted fan. .

    The Bandwagon comment was directly related to the callers you hear on Sports Radio- the knuckleheads that don’t know a knuckleball from a curveball- but cry to Charlie that he didn’t make a defensive sub of Mayberry for Pierre in the 8th inning – despite the fact that Pierre was leading off the next inning) etc. .ugh

     
  • Posts: 61 GM

    Avatar of GM

    I’ll start with this … “For the third time this series, the Phillies failed to score a run after the fifth inning.” … They scored in the ninth last night, maybe waiting until the game is over to write the recap isn’t such a bad idea.

    My next thought is about the criticism of Kendrick, I think he was mostly to blame for the 6th inning, but definitely not the 3rd. Putting all of the blame on Kendrick for last night isn’t really fair when the team can’t catch and they don’t hit. Unfortunately, people don’t like Kendrick and blame him even when its not completely his fault. He wasn’t perfect, but Pence jumping into the wall and missing Gwynn’s triple and then Mayberry’s error on the next plan certainly didn’t help. Those two plays were just as bad as Pierre’s 8th inning miss on Tuesday night, but you’d have a hard time finding someone to blame Lee for losing that game.

    It’s a team game, and last night they lost as a team, way too many failures last night to focus our frustrations on Kyle Kendrick alone. His 4 starts before last night he pitched 27 1/3 innings and gave up 6 total runs, 5 earned for a 1.65 ERA. If you look at the last 5 including last night its a 2.73 ERA. Not too bad for a 6th starter.

     
    • Posts: 61 GM

      Avatar of GM

      And before the comments start flowing, they did score 5 runs last night, but also missed some opportunities.

      9th – Wigginton on 2nd w/ 1 out, Thome strikes out looking, Schneider pops up.
      8th – Pierre on 1st w/ out, Pence grounds into DP

       
  • Posts: 0 TheDipsy

    I would trade Victorino, too. He’s a good player but he’s not what we need right now and he’s up after the season. And I gotta tell ya, I’m not in love with Hunter Pence. Just not. He can hit…unless he’s not hitting. And he is a crime scene in right field my god. Hunter pence ios one of those guys where if he’s not hitting…he doesn’t offer you anything. Here’s a thought: Lets add some speed and defense. lets go get Dee Gordon, the Campana kid from Chicago, and Emilio Bonificio (half tongue in cheek).

    With great starting pitching, speed and defense can carry you a VERY long way. And its cheaper. And it never slumps.

    The Dipsy

     
    • Posts: 0 c schreiber

      Which one of the Big 3 pitchers you suggest we trade for one of them.because that is what it would cost.

       
    • Posts: 1135 EricL

      Avatar of EricL

      I’m not sure why you would want Dee Gordon if you’re looking for defense. He’s a butcher in the field. He’s also kind of pathetic at the plate, so…maybe not him right now.

       
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    Kyle Kendrick is the LEAST of this team’s problems. People like to moan and complain about him because his last name isn’t Lee, Hamels or Halladay … or he doesn’t have cool glasses like Vanimal. But, the truth is, he’s pitched pretty well over the past 2 years and i’m damn glad Ruben re-signed him like he did.

     
    • Posts: 1190 Manny

      Avatar of Manny

      I agree with you on this Chuck, though the contract we gave him was a little too much and wasn’t a smart way to spend money… BUT so far, KK is doing a fine job.

       
  • Posts: 0 Mazinman

    I was listening to the game yesterday on the internet and, as I did, I almost fell hard as I tripped on something on my room. The first thing that came across my mind was:

    “Don’t tell me the injury bug is spreading to us fans now!”

    Ruben needs to do something now. There is an epic decision to be made whether or not the team will be buyers or sellers. I think he needs to have a serious talk with everyone involved and make a decision instead of letting things make the decision for him. If the team will go for it this year they need to do something right now otherwise it won’t matter when the Injured players get back. We don’t have an easy June.

     
    • Posts: 0 Don M

      There is nothing to buy or sell right now…… the trade market doesn’t start to take shape for another month – and this year, with the extra Wild Card team – more teams will think they have a chance ….which means less Sellers …….which means if you are a team that is “selling” – you might get overpaid for your players . . . . maybe Victorino brings back a TON

       
      • Posts: 0 c schreiber

        The trade market for the Phils is now.. They need to unload Lee or Hamels while their worth something to others. If they unload Lee his salary loss will help greatly with the contract for Cole. The Phils are going nowhere but down and when and if Utley and Howard get back they will be out of it anyway and when and if they get back the best we can ask of them is how they finished the season last year which wasn’t very good. THE SEASON IS OVER FOR US THIS YEAR. Get something for someone others will give up quality for.

         
      • Posts: 1135 EricL

        Avatar of EricL

        Honest, I’d rather them trade Pence. He’s got another year of team control and is younger than Victorino, and is thus likely to bring back a lot more talent in any trade.

        Also, because I hate his brain-dead style of play.

         
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    I still think that signing Rollins was the right move… despite everyone’s love affair with Galvis (he’s the new Chris Coste, Lou Marson, Wilson Valdez …. cool to like him too much) ..

    I think that defensively – Rollins is still too solid to let go – and at his worst – he’s still better than Galvis in almost every meaningful offensive category. . . I like Galvis – I just don’t overvalue him the way many seem to right now…. for every clutch hit he’s had- he’s looked overmatched twice as often

    , and I think that a position-change needs to happen for next season…. either Utley to LF… or Rollins to 3b

    To me, the biggest thing that determines the Phillies future … is Domonic Brown – did we keep the right player (Travis D’Arnaud aside) . . . The Phillies made Brown the one guy that was untouchable – we need him to show us why in the years to come

    I like Vic, but I think Mayberry can play CF – if Vic were to be traded at the deadline – he’d likely be the best offensive option out there, with a legit chance to gain a super-prospect ……..and the difference he gives you offensively – I don’t think will win us games in the postseason . . . . I still believe we need to shut teams down with our starting pitching (if Lee holds that lead in Game 2- we beat the Cards that series)…… again, I wouldn’t want Ruben’s job – too many difficult decisions

     
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    How about BOTH Utley to LF and Rollins to 3B?? And does it make sense to pick up Polly’s option and make him a super-sub…playing a lot of 2B???

     
    • Posts: 61 GM

      Avatar of GM

      If you are planning to keep Polanco, you would leave him at 3B.

       
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      Do people think that LF will be easier on his knees? I would have thought that that sustained sprinting full speed after several balls every night might be worse than the quick bursts and turns at second.

      I am also interested to see if he’s still one of the best fielders at second, as he was as recently as last year. It may be that this year his knees no longer allow that, but that remains to be seen.

       
      • Posts: 0 George

        Excellent point. Chipper Jones was moved from 3rd to LF, but had to be moved back; his legs bothered him too much in the outfield. The only others I can think of who successfully made similar moves never had bad legs.

         
  • Posts: 0 upandaway

    Agreed, Chuck. KK has provided real value on this roster,doing whatever is asked of him, including emergency starts. Those are tough, with no preparation.

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    From what i’ve read . . . . one of Utley’s biggest problems was the ball to his right (up the middle)…. where he had to plant-hard and throw to 1b ….

    a play that he wouldn’t have to make in LF …… in the NL- the closest postion to DH, is arguably LF, so you can keep his bat in the lineup (while you’re paying him $15 M)… with a better chance to keep him on the field-

    The other question is what works best for the organization . . . to me, the LF next year either needs to be Utley or Brown ……….

     
    • Posts: 0 George

      What about those hits down the line in left? Aren’t those situations where he’d have to go right, plant, and fire the ball to second? What about having to make a leap at the wall?

      Left field is as close to DH as any position, probably, but it’s still light years away defensively. A DH will never suddenly have to catch something.

       
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    schmenkman, ultimately Utley should probably be a DH…but that doesn’t help the Phillies, except for a few games a year. I would think that making the pivot at second would be harder on the knees but maybe not??

    GM, if Rollins would move to third….which I and a few others have suggested a few times … and Utley to left….someone would need to play second. I would imagine that Galvis would be the natural fit for SS. All this is pure speculation, of course.

     
    • Posts: 61 GM

      Avatar of GM

      Defensively, the infield has been pretty good. I’m not sure why you would shuffle 3 existing pieces if Polanco returns.

      I understand shifting Rollins & Galvis if Polly isn’t back, and I’m OK with Utley to left as well if it keeps him on the field.

       
    • Posts: 0 Ryne Duren

      hey chuck, i was checking the phils minor web sites and they have a 2cd basemen whose numbers offensively look pretty decent. i don’t know what kind of fielder he is but from the stats he looks like a contact hitter! he does’t s.o. much and has speed. his name is cesar hernandez. i think he was moved up to reading this year. the other guy harold garcia who was on reading slated to be moved up to LHV tore his knee up in S.T he’s out for the year. they also have a guy cody asche at lakewood whose numbers indicate he’s a contact hitter . he’s a college draftee he’s 22 i see him moving up fast he’s batting 343. as of yesterday, and has power and some speed. if things get too bad this year i don’t see why they couldn’t fast track some of these guys. i’ve been following them and every level up they improved. so if they had to move some players they do have guys in the minors. these are the guys they want cause they seem to be some of the best kept secrets. the one thing that has ticked me more than anything about the phils over the years is their lack of bringing guys up to give them a shot! i think cholly screwed up brown.his bat is fine they should have tutored him on the fielding aspect. it’s always this guy isn’t ready or this or that. it was because of injuries to polanco and thome that utley and howard got their chance. i think that will be the case with some of these other guys i mentioned.

       
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    It all depends on what the needs are too . . . and if Galvis is a .240-.250 hitter vs a .210-.220 hitter, etc . . .

    If Galvis is Gold Glove worthy at 2b, and can hit for an average-Average …. maybe the play is to keep him at 2b (where Utley would have limited range) to ensure that defensively, the Rollins-Galvis combo up the middle is just about as strong as any team in baseball . . .

    if Galvis can’t hit, gets exposed, and can’t adjust . . . . then Utley stays put … or Rollins stays put (with the Phillies picking up the Polanco option) . ..

    too many unknowns right now

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Absolutely disgraceful.

    4 errors?
    Lots of empty seats.

    Apparently the sell out strak is fictional anyway.

    I guess since the GM and the orginazation are just throwing in the towel we should too.
    This is acceptable. And it isnt changing.
    Would take some bold moves and they are too gutless to do any of them.

    Would rather dangle the Utley Howard carrot out there for the dumbed down fans who think Wheeler and Mccarthy are speaking the gospel.

    Oh well. The deat goes on.

    At least Carter and Richards get to hoist the cup. Oh that sucks too.

     
    • Posts: 875 schmenkman

      Avatar of schmenkman

      “Absolutely disgraceful.”

      Agreed.

      What’s this about the sellout streak?

       
  • Posts: 2 dcurcio25

    Avatar of dcurcio25

    Had a 3-0 lead today, blew it, yet again…if any team can find a way to lose games, it’s ours. Ready to see some major moves being made before, during, and after the all star break. These guys have no fire, and no one is stepping up to be a leader. All anyone does in interviews is say that they do their part and the rest is out of their hands…when the phuck did that become an excuse while playing on a “Team”. get the f outta here

     
  • Posts: 0 Don M

    Who cares about the sellout streak – I think they’ve already sold over 3 million tickets for this season

    It’s obvious with all the moves he’s made over the past three seasons that Amaro is definitely throwing in the towel…

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    They have different ways of equaling a sell out.
    Its like the government and unemployment figures.
    They make them up and what not.

    But I really dont care. This bunch is so bad that it wont be close enough to make up a number soon enough.

    I really think they need a Kirk Gibson/Bowa type of manager who would go insane after a game like today.
    The phils make teams bullpens look s good.

    I love how Mccarthy and Wheeler keep saying that in inter league this year the Phillies have an advantage because of Thome?
    Really????????????????????????????
    And you are even pretending to be serious broadcasters?

     
  • Posts: 0 Dave

    Utley will not be playing second base. If he does, he won’t be playing long and will be hurt again. He’s either going to need to go to the OF or go to the AL and be a DH. His cartilage is not going to reform. He’s not getting younger. If he doesn’t realize this, then he’s an idiot.

     
    • Posts: 61 GM

      Avatar of GM

      Thanks for the update Dr. Dave! When did you last examine the patient?

       
      • Posts: 0 Dave

        I’m no doctor GM, but i have stayed at a Holiday Inn recently! Seriously, I’m just using common sense here. Each of the last 2 years he’s needed 8 months to get ready to play. He’s not going to suddenly get healthier with his issue.

         
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    @ Don

    You think Ruben Minaya Jr. has done a good job.

    Very tough to take someone with that point of view seriously.

    You have a 176 million pay roll.

    But then you think he improved the team in the offseason.

    Ill clue you in. When your team is all old guys they get worse each year.
    Since all the old guys are locked in long term next years team will be worse.

    vice vera a player like Bryce Harper who is young will be better next year.
    But Polanco and Lee and Halladay will be worse.

    I know I gave up on trying to help you understand the sport a year ago. But there is one more try.

     
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    Yeah, we saw how well the Phillies did when Larry Bowa was the manager…

     
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    Andrew, a question…. are you somehow related to Abner Doubleday? You know, the guy that supposedly invented the sport? Cause you always want to try to explain the game of baseball to the rest of us idiots on here all the time…

     
  • Posts: 0 Andrew from Waldorf

    Chuck
    I dont want Bowa.
    He was an extreme. All the players hated him.

    Manuel is an extreme to the other side. When you had the best team in the majors that worked. It doesnt work with a mediocre over paid prima donna team.

    This isnt working. And Id like to thnk there is a chance. Before this gets too far out of hand. Since firing the GM is more fore the future. It has to be Manuel. If they want to have a prayer this year. Its not fair as Charlie doesnt deserve it. Firing Ruben Minaya wont matter for this year. He deserves to be fired 1,000,000 times more than Charlie.

    BTW doubleday didnt even really invent baseball they made that story up.
    Believe it or not

     
    • Posts: 0 c schreiber

      Do you really believe its cholly’s fault?? Since when is it the manager’s fault when no seems to be able to drive in a runner in scoring position or misplays a ball for an error or takes a third strike with runners in scoring position or misjudges a flyball or throws a home run ball. Really the manager’s fault.

       
    • Posts: 0 Ryne Duren

      the happy mediam would have to be none other than ryne sanberg! i wish they would just do it asap! he would give input as to who in the minors are ready more so than cholly! he’s the guy who sat brown when he played lousey LF! i’d have sat rollins and vic for their lack of offense!

       
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    Andrew – I know that Doubleday didn’t invent baseball. That’s why I said SUPPOSEDLY. Jesus. Do you always have to act like you know everything???

     
  • Posts: 0 George

    Today’s mess points up a few things that should be done, but maybe can’t be yet:

    1. Release Qualls.
    2. Send Mayberry down to work on his hitting.
    3. Never use Wigginton at third.
    4. Prepare to trade at least one player of value, even if it’s for the future and not the present. (The present is almost done for, anyway.)

    This team, for many different reasons (bad luck, bad play, bad bullpen, aces not pitching like aces,bad hitting with runners in scoring position, injuries) is sinking fast, and It may be time to rethink the current team makeup. Fans complain that Manuel has no clue, but watching this team play, I wouldn’t have one either. The performances have been baffling. Sometimes the only way to get around what’s perplexing is just to make some changes.

     
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    Well, here’s a change…and I’m not necessarily proposing it, either. But I know it will come up. Should Charlie be fired? I personally don’t think so but it’s a common thing that teams do sometimes mid-season in order to shake things up and change the culture. I’ve heard that the clubhouse is a mess. So is that on Charlie??

     
    • Posts: 0 Dave

      Chuck, where did you hear that? Are you referring to the Lee/Victorino incident or other stuff that’s been more recent?

       
  • Posts: 2993 Chuck A.

    Avatar of Chuck A.

    I’ve heard it on the radio. Supposedly, some guys that have access to the clubhouse and mentioned it. I would think that the Lee/Vic incident certainly is part of it.

    Pat Gallen….any insight???

     
  • Posts: 0 bacardipr05

    Just not pretty. Theres something wrong here and goes beyond Utley/Howard. Actually a few “somethings”. Im not sure how they going to fix this. The PH of this team is dipping into the acidic rancid stage. Perhaps some of these guys have been together too long. Maybe too many old guys on this team. We need help ASAP. I thought maybe they would stay afloat till Allstar, and maybe a few days off would help. Now im not so sure of that.

     
    • Posts: 0 c schreiber

      Maybe too many old guys on team?? Really. This season is over as this team will not make the playoffs if they add two more slots. A major trade will have too be made and even then it should be for the future. Lee or Hamels need to be involved as thats the only guys we’ll be able to get any quality “young” players for. If they can trade Lee and his salary that will be the $$$ for Cole’s new contract.

       
    • Posts: 0 Ryne Duren

      i think you’re on to something with the PH thing! if you noticed in years past they had a confidence, a swagger if you will. that they could overcome being behind by 4 runs. i checked the orioles site and looked at their power stats they’ve only hit 11 more homers than us! yet they’re at the top and we’re at the bottom! the phils lack a confidence to come back! they hit homers but not with many guys on base. if they did their record would be better. however they don’t and it’s not! why? i don’t know, but it seems like they grind the bat to sawdust in the clutch. maybe they bought into the wait for utley howard to come back thing. maybe they don’t feel that management has their backs. after all it was cholly and rube who said from the get go that all they expected was to tread water till the second coming. i think the talent is still there it’s a mental thing. the only way to change that is to change the manager. it’s the quickest way without disrupting the whole cart. and players who still don’t do anything after that (i’d give them a grace period) then move em! to the bench or out! by the way my first thought on PH was power hungry lol.

       
 
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